Rods - am I missing a trick?

[ga33a]

As I mentioned in my introduction post I've been away from fishing for over 10 years. Coming back a lot of things seem to have changed.

I was walking around a lake at the weekend trying to decide if I wanted to join the angling club that ran the water and having a good chat to the guys on the bank.

Among other things I noticed was the rods that everyone seemed to be using. My rods are all 12ft long so I was quite surprised to see that the majority of the ones in use were 9 or 10ft at most.

I still have my old rods but was thinking of treating myself to some new ones so my question is, why 9ft? What do I need to know? Do I chose the same test curve or do I need to scale this up/down for the new rod length?

Years ago I did have a shorter stalking rod for close in work that was great for walking around the lake and taking advantage of opportunistic targets, it was a lot easier than lugging a 12 footer through trees and overhanging branches but it never occurred to me to use it as a main rod on my pod. I was probably just following the herd as that was the thinking of the time but I'd be grateful for any advice on rod length that anyone on here can provide.

Cheers guys

[yonny]

16 minutes ago, ga33a said:

why 9ft?

For a small percentage of anglers it's because they fish small water with tight swims.

For others it's to save weight/space and to support the mobile angling approach.

For most it's a fashion statement imo. Sacrificing casting distance to sport the latest must-have kit.

I will always use 12 ft rods, they allow me to do everything.

[oscsha]

If your rods worked 10 years agao they will still work now , stick with what you know and have to start with . Carp fishing has its fashions .

[ga33a]

Hi guys and thanks for the replies. Trust me I'm far to long in the tooth to follow fashion and way too tight to spend money on things I don't need. But, as I'm thinking of changing my rods anyway (they're at least 20 years old, have been repaired multiple times and are getting a bit tired now) I just wanted to know, as the thread title says, if there was anything to gain with these smaller rods?

I don't care about what size they break up into for transport or what they look like, just if there's anything to gain in terms of say playing fish, bite indication or feel?

[yonny]

7 minutes ago, ga33a said:

I don't care about what size they break up into for transport or what they look like, just if there's anything to gain in terms of say playing fish, bite indication or feel?

Nah, they wont benefit you imo mate.

[Carpbell_ll]

For some of us shorter guys a 10'' rod is easier to cast that a 12'' rod i can get better distance with more accuracy with my 10 footers, i don't buy into the whole better to cast under trees, when i was using 12's in a tight swim i would just pop a pair of waders on and stand in the margins to cast out. 

Really happy with my Fox Torques some of the other brands are a bit pricey and i don't like telescopic rods, if i was after a set of twelve foot rods again and had the money i would definitely go for the Torques again, the only downside being they don't come with a line clip. Fox sell those separate. 

[yonny]

26 minutes ago, Carpbell_ll said:

i can get better distance with more accuracy with my 10 footers

That is an issue with technique mate. It is not possible to cast further with a 10 than it is a 12 ft rod bud. The blank simply cannot be compressed with the same load.

[elmoputney]

I use 10ft rods mainly because all the swims i want to fish are overgrown and have over hanging trees,it does make a difference to me as the margins are deep and my 12 foot spomb seems to catch on the trees behind,

given the choice and the space, I think I would use a 12 foot rod, but the 10 footers do a good job and have performed well in tight situations for me this year, although I don't need to hit the horizon,for that I would definately prefer a 12 foot or longer rod 

[harpz_31]

I had 12 footers in a tight swim at the weekend and casting was a pain because of low branches so I ended up kneeling down to cast, plus playing fish was a nightmare with trees to the left and right so no matter which way I pulled my rod it was hitting the trees so in times like that 10 foot rods are a massive advantage but in comfortable pegs with plenty of room I dont see the point.

[ga33a]

Sounds very much, from the responses so far, that the smaller rods are mainly to get around fishing in tight confines or making it easier to pack in the car. The waters in my new club have pretty good access and I have an estate car so I figure I’m probably better off going for another set of twelve footers. I don’t need the smaller rods to get around casting clearance problems and I may, at some point, be glad of the extra range I’ll get from the longer rods.

As always, thanks again for the help guys

[smufter]

When I was younger and first starting out, I used a variety of rods, but they were mainly 9' or 10' leger or float rods. That has stayed with me through later life, and I find shorter rods much easier to handle than 12 footers. 

I personally use 11 footers, and find them absolutely perfect for the fishing I do, mainly smaller, estate type lakes, overhanging trees, tight swims, where accuracy is far more important than distance. Having said that, I've just returned from a French trip with 5 mates and certainly didn't feel disadvantaged against them using their longer rods. I got my bait where I needed to get it to!

They don't save me any room in the car by the way, as I use a 12' rod sleeve for them.... have never been able to find an 11' one!

 

 

Edited July 30, 2019 by smufter

[bluelabel]

On 29/07/2019 at 10:33, yonny said:

For most it's a fashion statement imo. Sacrificing casting distance to sport the latest must-have kit.

have to disagree partially with that Yonny... Terry Edmonds (I think it was he) got 170 yards with a 9' Dwarf 3lb rod....  and to be honest there's very few anglers who can hit that with a 12 footer, and of course you are right about fashion. (I bought mine because.... A, I fish small waters... & B, they fit in the boot of my car without lowering the back seats... and C, the wife bought me them as a prezzy for looking after her when she broke her pelvis... I think the biggest chuck I've had since I got them is just under 90 yards... more than enough for most folks

in response to the original Poster, the old adage "if it ain't broke don't fix it comes into play"... why change your rods if you are comfortable with them... they'll still land what you hook...👍😎

Edited July 30, 2019 by bluelabel

[yonny]

12 minutes ago, bluelabel said:

have to disagree partially with that Yonny... Terry Edmonds (I think it was he) got 170 yards with a 9' Dwarf 3lb rod....

Terry is the casting world record holder!

I'm pretty sure Usain Bolt can run fast in steel toe caps but that doesn't mean steel toe caps are good for running.

19 minutes ago, bluelabel said:

I think the biggest chuck I've had since I got them is just under 90 yards... more than enough for most folks

If the carp are 100 yards away it's not good enough for any folks!

Just my opinion you understand buddy.... a 12 footer can do everything a 10 footer can but that doesn't work the other way round.

[smufter]

7 minutes ago, yonny said:

Terry is the casting world record holder!

I'm pretty sure Usain Bolt can run fast in steel toe caps but that doesn't mean steel toe caps are good for running.

If the carp are 100 yards away it's not good enough for any folks!

Just my opinion you understand buddy.... a 12 footer can do everything a 10 footer can but that doesn't work the other way round.

Only any good to you Yonny if you want to do what a 12 footer could do

😉

[carpyian]

ive got 12ft6 torrix and they can cast a very long distance and playing fish on them is a dream waters I fish are pressured so need the distance to reach the fish if I fished over grown swims where I needed the smaller rods id have to buy some but atm I don't 

[bluelabel]

30 minutes ago, yonny said:

If the carp are 100 yards away it's not good enough for any folks!

I refer the honourable gentleman to the reply I gave some time ago

53 minutes ago, bluelabel said:

A, I fish small waters...

or I'll move round to where the fish are...

 

31 minutes ago, yonny said:

Just my opinion you understand buddy.... a 12 footer can do everything a 10 footer can but that doesn't work the other way round.

except cast where the overhanging tree canopy dictates otherwise😋

 

one thing I have learned over the years.... there are precious few absolutes in fishing... not being contentious... just a few thoughts 

[kevtaylor]

I'm considering buying a couple of short rods but for stalking ONLY.

I'd never use those for my general fishing IMO 12 to 13ft rods are better for casting, playing and getting them out of weedbeds.

One member on my previous syndicate bought the Scopes for fashion purposes only.  He said to me he massively regretted it because he was hopelessly under gunned for the water and he lost fish because of them, weeded up - no backbone no length.

[smufter]

30 minutes ago, kevtaylor said:

I'm considering buying a couple of short rods but for stalking ONLY.

I'd never use those for my general fishing IMO 12 to 13ft rods are better for casting, playing and getting them out of weedbeds.

One member on my previous syndicate bought the Scopes for fashion purposes only.  He said to me he massively regretted it because he was hopelessly under gunned for the water and he lost fish because of them, weeded up - no backbone no length.

Casting distances, yes... but accuracy? I'd argue the point. And as for playing.... again I'd argue that point. My current 11 footers, (FreeSpirit TS's) and my previous Chub Outkast Smallwaters are/were brilliant "players" rods. And the little shorter length helps with netting fish, which surely is all part of playing???

 

[kevtaylor]

51 minutes ago, smufter said:

Casting distances, yes... but accuracy? I'd argue the point. And as for playing.... again I'd argue that point. My current 11 footers, (FreeSpirit TS's) and my previous Chub Outkast Smallwaters are/were brilliant "players" rods. And the little shorter length helps with netting fish, which surely is all part of playing???

 

My 12.6 Torrix TE's are players rods and they can cast long and accurate that's for sure.  Does 12.6 ft make any detrimental effect on playing and netting fish NO imo.

On weedy waters (nearly all waters I fish) the 12ft or more length helps extract them from the weed beds.

I want short stalking rods just for under trees where you cant lift the rod upright coz it's too long.

I dont understand why you think a shorter rod casts more accurately, I'd argue the opposite is true

 

 

[elmoputney]

I think it all comes Down to the right tools for the job, personally I think my small rods are great for what I do, I can cast them accurately possibly more so than when using 12ft rods at similar distances, I like the fact they don't take up as much of my swim as these are usually quite tight, I've yet to really need to launch one but I think they could cast a fair way if needs be, yes they aren't an out and out casting tool but they aren't really designed for that, I think there will be a time when I have a need for more than one set of rods and then I will probably be looking for something over 12ft for distance or increased distance anyway but for small waters I think they are perfectly usable 

[nigewoodcock]

4 hours ago, kevtaylor said:

My 12.6 Torrix TE's are players rods and they can cast long and accurate that's for sure.  Does 12.6 ft make any detrimental effect on playing and netting fish NO imo.

On weedy waters (nearly all waters I fish) the 12ft or more length helps extract them from the weed beds.

I want short stalking rods just for under trees where you cant lift the rod upright coz it's too long.

I dont understand why you think a shorter rod casts more accurately, I'd argue the opposite is true

 

 

I’m more accurate with a pin hammer than I am with a sledge 😉 

[kevtaylor]

18 minutes ago, nigewoodcock said:

I’m more accurate with a pin hammer than I am with a sledge 😉 

Good one Nige, however I am more accurate with a normal claw type hammer, which again proves that in most situations the middle sized or 12ft rod is best/more versatile.

That being said, all hammers/rods have their place in the tool box/rod bag for a given job/angling situation.

I'm here till sunday!

[nigewoodcock]

Your right mate. Tools for different applications. I have a few sets of 12fts, a set of 10’s, 9’s and 6fts. I use all of them! Not at the same time mind 😂 

The 10’s are probably my most used length. I can get around 110yards out of them. Anything more, then I have to go back to the torrix 12ft 3 1/4. There’s not many lakes that I fish at the moment where I need that extra distance though.  

On the fish playing front, I find the 10’s have more holding power than any of my 12’s although not much in it for it to be a deciding factor. 

Fashion..... when I started fishing, all those years ago, all the specimin rods were 10 or 11 ft, until it became fashion to have 12 footers, then 13’s. 

At the end of the day, everyone should buy and use what suits their own situation best. If I could only afford one set of rods, for what I do at the moment, the 10footers would be my choice. 5 years ago, when I was fishing a much bigger lake and also still doing a bit on horseshoe, it would have been 12 foot rods. Funny thing is, I can cast further with my 12ft rods than I did using Terry Edmonds’ 13 footers on our tutorials we had (using the same reel, swapped over to both rods). I may have got further with them if I used them regularly. I’m only knee high to an ewok though so that might have something to do with it. Phil can blast his 13 footers further than his 12’s.

It’s not so much being able to compress the blanks but having a larger arc. This increases the lead speed, which is what ultimately loads the rods. There’s so much more to casting than what rods we use. I would guess 90% technique and 10% equipment (as long as it’s a decent rod) 

[kevtaylor]

11 minutes ago, nigewoodcock said:

Your right mate. Tools for different applications. I have a few sets of 12fts, a set of 10’s, 9’s and 6fts. I use all of them! Not at the same time mind 😂 

The 10’s are probably my most used length. I can get around 110yards out of them. Anything more, then I have to go back to the torrix 12ft 3 1/4. There’s not many lakes that I fish at the moment where I need that extra distance though.  

On the fish playing front, I find the 10’s have more holding power than any of my 12’s although not much in it for it to be a deciding factor. 

Fashion..... when I started fishing, all those years ago, all the specimin rods were 10 or 11 ft, until it became fashion to have 12 footers, then 13’s. 

At the end of the day, everyone should buy and use what suits their own situation best. If I could only afford one set of rods, for what I do at the moment, the 10footers would be my choice. 5 years ago, when I was fishing a much bigger lake and also still doing a bit on horseshoe, it would have been 12 foot rods. Funny thing is, I can cast further with my 12ft rods than I did using Terry Edmonds’ 13 footers on our tutorials we had (using the same reel, swapped over to both rods). I may have got further with them if I used them regularly. I’m only knee high to an ewok though so that might have something to do with it. Phil can blast his 13 footers further than his 12’s.

It’s not so much being able to compress the blanks but having a larger arc. This increases the lead speed, which is what ultimately loads the rods. There’s so much more to casting than what rods we use. I would guess 90% technique and 10% equipment (as long as it’s a decent rod) 

I'd love a couple of 6's, 9's, 10,s and maybe 13's coz they all have a place.

I used my 12's for stalking and didn't really struggle or think at the time if only they were shorter, I had never seen anyone using shorter rods back then.  I have however since seen situations where the 6's or 9's were needed in at least 3lb or higher TC for stalking out of trees and such like and wish I had some.

My mate stalked a 66lb mirror from under a tree on hols and to say a shorter rod would have come in handy is an understatement, what a struggle, we asked everywhere for a 9ft rod and no joy.

Theres deffo a market for shorter rod sets, but I'd question anyone buying them as a fashion or thinking they are the normal all rounder.

[oscsha]

I blame Alan Blair LOL,.

The waters I'm fishing at the moment mean i use my 11 or 12 ft rods .

As others have said I do see a use for shorter rods but not as all rounders , but its fashion same as using big pit reels for everything .