New bait required

[newmarket]

17 hours ago, elmoputney said:

Having a sale is probably quite a good tactic in getting people to switch to your bait company tbh, a couple of weeks of discounted bait will boost sales get rid of old stock, boost turnover and hopefully get you some new long term customers, if they choose to cut quality then they are probably doing themselves a disservice as they won't be as likely to retain new customers, 

 

I think with Essential it was a way of plugging the winterised version of their new KS10 bait .

I wouldn’t have thought they had a lot of ‘old stock’ lying about to shift but I take your point generally mate . 
In my experience people tend to stick with what they know bait wise but you never really know what’s going on behind the scenes with the price and availability of ingredients etc .

Call me an old glory hunter 🤣 but I’ll always use an ancient well established and therefore trusted bait company .

When I first started with the Carp I had to make a decision somewhere and , I dunno why now thinking about it , but I plumped for CC Moore . Somewhere along the line I changed to Essential baits and I really can’t remember why but there IS a sort of pattern forming lol

[elmoputney]

11 hours ago, newmarket said:

I think with Essential it was a way of plugging the winterised version of their new KS10 bait .

I wouldn’t have thought they had a lot of ‘old stock’ lying about to shift but I take your point generally mate . 
In my experience people tend to stick with what they know bait wise but you never really know what’s going on behind the scenes with the price and availability of ingredients etc .

Call me an old glory hunter 🤣 but I’ll always use an ancient well established and therefore trusted bait company .

When I first started with the Carp I had to make a decision somewhere and , I dunno why now thinking about it , but I plumped for CC Moore . Somewhere along the line I changed to Essential baits and I really can’t remember why but there IS a sort of pattern forming lol

I've been through some phases lol, I would've used the original company I used as Nick did, because I had caught quite a few using them before but when I returned to fishing they were no more, I went through a few baits and couldn't settle,probably me not the bait but then I had 3 good years with retro and would have stuck with them but sadly that wasn't to be, now I am going local and trying innovate, I did quite a lot of research and had a chat with them, it's always a bit of a gamble but they seem to have a good local following and from looking through social media, there baits have caught some decent carp and I also mean tough to catch local carp too, including some of St Ives prized residents, they list a lot of the ingredients I like to have in a bait and time and results will tell but on paper the baits sound decent they have been around for a while and they steam baits rather than boil them, which I also like the idea of, hopefully the results will follow, but I do have the Elmo factor which doesn't help 😂

[salokcinnodrog]

12 hours ago, newmarket said:

I think with Essential it was a way of plugging the winterised version of their new KS10 bait .

I wouldn’t have thought they had a lot of ‘old stock’ lying about to shift but I take your point generally mate . 
In my experience people tend to stick with what they know bait wise but you never really know what’s going on behind the scenes with the price and availability of ingredients etc .

Call me an old glory hunter 🤣 but I’ll always use an ancient well established and therefore trusted bait company .

When I first started with the Carp I had to make a decision somewhere and , I dunno why now thinking about it , but I plumped for CC Moore . Somewhere along the line I changed to Essential baits and I really can’t remember why but there IS a sort of pattern forming lol

Coming on along with @elmoputney 's post as well. I think that the only ready-made baits around when I started were Richworths. I went through Honey Yucatan, which I caught more on than Tutti-frutti, and Salmon Supreme. Then came the joy of upsetting my mother with homemade specials. Chappie dog food, semolina, ground pond pellets and eggs, stunk to high heaven but caught.

I then started playing with Nutrabaits, but Brian Hewitt and New Concept Baits Mariner Mix really caught me, and loads of fish. I'd love to get that recipe back. I was rolling bait for him and myself with a concrete mixer! Shame Brian sold the company. 

Back to Nutrabaits I saw how Enervite really turned on the carp in Weybread Number 1, and then how The Biollix caught on Barham and Taverham. I was using that more than BFM.

The switch to Trigga though, absolutely amazing. I ended up getting B&F to make it up for me I was rolling so much, probably using 10kilos a month. They also started selling my 'tweaked' Trigga baits as using Nutrabaits ingredients.

They asked me to test their baits when I moved onto Ardleigh and I caught the first fish on the 42 range. Weird, for some reason I missed a few years 'session' fishing, probably due to the love of my life, only doing the occasional night, but still had input into the next test baits, Smokey Bacon which I took onto Nazeing, followed by Smoked Mackeral. I also came up with the combinations on a few of their pop-ups.

In fact only 1 bait I could not catch on, no matter how much I saw the carp eating it in the snags. Then as they say, B&F fell apart at the seams.

Kind of left me holding a paddle but the canoe had a hole, so I started using Solar, again testing for them, the original Seafood Takeaway in frozen and shelfie. 

The move workwise for me to Gladwells, meant I could get my hands on Crafty Catcher and Rod Hutchinson baits as the factory rolled both, (they also roll the Ringers Match baits).

While I like Crafty Catcher, especially King Prawn and Crab Meat and Sea Salt,  I seemed to do better on RH, the KMG produced loads on Alton, and both Monster Crab and Infusion have produced on the syndicate as well.

 

[elmoputney]

I couldn't resist buying those hair raisers at the top they smelt lovely squid and octopus fruit and black pepper,banarama hairaisers and choco malt jaffa pop ups, well happy with my bait collection, proper carp anglers, proper baits, reaper nut mix smells and tastes great, not heavily flavoured quite soft mmmm😋 the fix is a little firmer but looks like a proper red fishmeal and has a nice low level peachy flavour, all shelf life too, 😳 I think I did well, hopefully I can catch some nice fish on them now and if I need bait in a rush I can just pop in the car and get some, happy days 

Edited December 1, 2022 by elmoputney

[B B]

On 30/11/2022 at 17:54, salokcinnodrog said:

Coming on along with @elmoputney 's post as well. I think that the only ready-made baits around when I started were Richworths. I went through Honey Yucatan, which I caught more on than Tutti-frutti, and Salmon Supreme. Then came the joy of upsetting my mother with homemade specials. Chappie dog food, semolina, ground pond pellets and eggs, stunk to high heaven but caught.

I then started playing with Nutrabaits, but Brian Hewitt and New Concept Baits Mariner Mix really caught me, and loads of fish. I'd love to get that recipe back. I was rolling bait for him and myself with a concrete mixer! Shame Brian sold the company. 

Back to Nutrabaits I saw how Enervite really turned on the carp in Weybread Number 1, and then how The Biollix caught on Barham and Taverham. I was using that more than BFM.

The switch to Trigga though, absolutely amazing. I ended up getting B&F to make it up for me I was rolling so much, probably using 10kilos a month. They also started selling my 'tweaked' Trigga baits as using Nutrabaits ingredients.

They asked me to test their baits when I moved onto Ardleigh and I caught the first fish on the 42 range. Weird, for some reason I missed a few years 'session' fishing, probably due to the love of my life, only doing the occasional night, but still had input into the next test baits, Smokey Bacon which I took onto Nazeing, followed by Smoked Mackeral. I also came up with the combinations on a few of their pop-ups.

In fact only 1 bait I could not catch on, no matter how much I saw the carp eating it in the snags. Then as they say, B&F fell apart at the seams.

Kind of left me holding a paddle but the canoe had a hole, so I started using Solar, again testing for them, the original Seafood Takeaway in frozen and shelfie. 

The move workwise for me to Gladwells, meant I could get my hands on Crafty Catcher and Rod Hutchinson baits as the factory rolled both, (they also roll the Ringers Match baits).

While I like Crafty Catcher, especially King Prawn and Crab Meat and Sea Salt,  I seemed to do better on RH, the KMG produced loads on Alton, and both Monster Crab and Infusion have produced on the syndicate as well.

 

That was a interesting post  👍

The first bag of bait i bought was frozen Richworths tutti,  awww what a smell we used it on carp societies horseshoe and had some fish on it 

Mainlines Cell changed my results every one was using it on Linear god knows how much they sold of it. 

[elmoputney]

I need some more new bait 😀  the mice have been in my bag, the only pop ups they took from about 10 pots were the proper job KLS, 😢

If you haven't used these they have been my go too ever since I got them, it was always the one to go first, they haven't managed to get in my bins yet though the little pricks which is lucky I guess 🤔

[ouchthathurt]

The first ever boilies I brought were a company called “freebies bait products” they did a savoury bait that smelt of bacon. Next were richworth tutti fruitti, strawberry jam and banana ester boilies. They also did a ginger boilie that was pretty good. My first basemix was carp company fruit frenzy basemix with RH mixed herbs flavour, with salmon oil and fruit factor 6 (if I remember correctly) I remember getting the mainline grange basemix too. Then I moved onto premier aminos GLM basemix in 97 and haven’t looked back. Still using premier aminos and/or matrix to this day. 

On 01/12/2022 at 21:22, B B said:

That was a interesting post  👍

The first bag of bait i bought was frozen Richworths tutti,  awww what a smell we used it on carp societies horseshoe and had some fish on it 

Mainlines Cell changed my results every one was using it on Linear god knows how much they sold of it. 

 

[Carpbell3]

My recipe for my home made bait cost is 11 quid a kilo roughly, going with a working title as Agent Orange due to how and where I want to fish it waters with lots of food and pond weed.

A Very well packed HNV made with fresh natural products starting with 800 grams of the tropamino base mix seems best value by far the other 200 grams to make the kilo up will be a ground mix of haiths PTX, Prosecto and Robin Orange.

Liquids other than eggs will be JBs liquid yeast and Essential baits fermented cranberry, I'm thinking I wouldn't need to add a flavour or sweetener to that mix.

My only concern is would i need to include a small amount of binding flour to the 200 grams of haiths mix to make up what is normally the amount of flour in a kilo of tropamino base mix?

[framey]

200 grams of bird seed?

have you asked John his advise on the seed inclusion

unless you have a mill to make most of it really fine I would think that would be a nightmare to roll it looks very crumby to me?

i would imagine the base mix has all the binders needed

[Carpbell3]

2 hours ago, framey said:

200 grams of bird seed?

have you asked John his advise on the seed inclusion

unless you have a mill to make most of it really fine I would think that would be a nightmare to roll it looks very crumby to me?

i would imagine the base mix has all the binders needed

The haiths kit has all sorts in it, egg biscuit molasses milled seeds, the robin orange is a pepper mush the inclusion rates are around 20 percent of over all mix I was thinking it would need running through a grinder, love the haiths products i know for a fact most bait companies use one of their Trinity mixes as the main attraction package in a bait.

The tropamino is a complete mix made up by a facebook group one or two of the bait rollers on here had some input to the mix.

[framey]

Ahh sorry

I thought tropamino was  a baker base mix 

[Carpbell3]

Think it's more of a best value for return expected.

On the portions and percentages I think including 50 grams of a basic 50/50 mix with 150 grams of haiths products would help blend it into the 800 grams of tropamino.

[framey]

A 50/50 mix is usually only semolina and soya flour 

you can buy a kilo of each for about £1 rather than tackle shop price

[salokcinnodrog]

2 hours ago, framey said:

A 50/50 mix is usually only semolina and soya flour 

you can buy a kilo of each for about £1 rather than tackle shop price

Pretty much no nutritional value whatsoever; there is very little usable protein, almost only carbohydrate.

The only thing it is good for is high attract hookbaits in my view.

 

If you add anything to it remember EVERY animal needs protein, fat and possibly carbohydrates, and vitamins and minerals.

Carp fed in scientific experiments required food with a protein percentage of 25-30%.

[Carpbell3]

The 50/50 mix from BAF is 30 percent protein think it's made up from maize and soy with added milk powder and a animal fat, it can be used as is.

I'm looking to make something simple but outstanding I'm not keen on going down the feed stim route that's the ingredients that if over done and I imagine all fish are different can be a repellent, not enough and there was no point in using it plus it is very expensive even in small amounts.

All the best baits I have used are brimming with natural attraction the cov gold had to be seen to be believed on the right day.

[framey]

8 hours ago, salokcinnodrog said:

Pretty much no nutritional value whatsoever; there is very little usable protein, almost only carbohydrate.

The only thing it is good for is high attract hookbaits in my view.

 

If you add anything to it remember EVERY animal needs protein, fat and possibly carbohydrates, and vitamins and minerals.

Carp fed in scientific experiments required food with a protein percentage of 25-30%.

Nick 

he is using the 50/50 as an “extra” to top up the mix as I read it.

[salokcinnodrog]

22 minutes ago, framey said:

Nick 

he is using the 50/50 as an “extra” to top up the mix as I read it.

I read that as well, but at the same time when you buy a base mix it is normally at optimum levels of ingredients for the compromise of cost,  nutrition and rolling.

Cutting it with maize meal, semolina or soya flour to make it go further is just doing what various bait companies have done and gone down for.

47 minutes ago, Carpbell3 said:

The 50/50 mix from BAF is 30 percent protein think it's made up from maize and soy with added milk powder and a animal fat, it can be used as is.

I'm looking to make something simple but outstanding I'm not keen on going down the feed stim route that's the ingredients that if over done and I imagine all fish are different can be a repellent, not enough and there was no point in using it plus it is very expensive even in small amounts.

All the best baits I have used are brimming with natural attraction the cov gold had to be seen to be believed on the right day.

I can give you a very basic base mix, that will work extremely well:

10% Liver Powder

20% Calcium Caseinate

30% Maize Flour

40% Semolina

Flavour wise, the Liquid Liver from Rod Hutchinson. I did used to use Nutrabaits Liver Elite.

You could modernise it with a hydrolysate in the eggs.

 

Now that was sold as a proprietary base mix or completed bait.

[Carpbell3]

If the haiths would go in the base mix as is I will do that but it will need milling if it will blend in and still roll OK I wouldn't use the 50/50 mix but I think it will struggle with out the 50 grams of plain base mix.

Just waiting for the January sales to see if I can get a deal on some rolling kit that takes the work out, nothing industrial just a leccy caulking gun and a buffalo 7 litre, plus a milling machine.