Books

[bluelabel]

I can forgive poor writing if it gets the story across... we all have something in us that can compensate for a questionable writing technique... it's called an imagination... sometimes you gotta use it....

[emmcee]

52 minutes ago, StinkyMink said:

Poor writing quality mate

I'm a bit of a wordy, and done some journalism and I read masses of books - poor writing quality grates really badly with me

When you say poor writing quality,  is that the way the story has been penned or the way it's written as in poor grammar etc? 

 

Edited April 28, 2020 by emmcee

[bluelabel]

If you haven't already... have a read of "How To Fish" by Chris Yates... its not about carp fishing...  but its superbly written and has a captivating quality, that draws the reader into his world of fishing, scrapes, fun, and almost spiritual enjoyment of the sport...

[bluelabel]

I think his book sales would say otherwise... we'll agree to differ...

[bluelabel]

So.... not being contentious here... but he's sold a lot of books, a lot of folks love his books and writing style, and he's been a British Carp record holder... and your qualifications are.....? 

Fine to say you don't like his style, but to dismiss his work out of hand smacks of narrow mindedness... 

[yonny]

11 hours ago, bluelabel said:

Fine to say you don't like his style, but to dismiss his work out of hand smacks of narrow mindedness... 

Tel is renowned as one of the great story tellers (within carp angling). His books are probably the most highly regarded of any in the modern era. I wasn't joking when I said Stinky is the first angler I've come across that doesn't rate his books.

It's fair enough if Stinky thinks they're no good and that they are made by reputation and subject interest, but imo several generations of carp anglers can't be wrong.

[salokcinnodrog]

There are many worse writers than Terry Hearn.

I have read goodness knows how many articles over 30years carp fishing, some article writers I would not read a book they wrote simply because their writing is so bad. Terry Hearn is not one of them, Jim Shelley for example is.

Even a slideshow by Terry Hearn is a must watch.

 

A magazine editor once wrote in one of his articles or books that there was only one writer whose work was perfect as it was received, Chris Yates. His writing style, humour even mean you can't put his books down.

Rod Hutchinson on the other hand, by his own admission was not a writer. He wrote it exactly as it happened, language and all. Years ago I met Rod Hutchinson at a talk and had a proper chat with him, he is exactly that, but his knowledge was amazing.

[bluelabel]

Met Rod a few times, lovely bloke but not a great writer, although the stories were often  funny as... I wouldn't put him down as one of the literary greats and neither did he... I finished "Before I Forget" a few weeks ago and it was a laugh, but not a great book... (would have been nice if someone had finished it for him... RIP Rod 

[emmcee]

39 minutes ago, salokcinnodrog said:

 

Rod Hutchinson on the other hand, by his own admission was not a writer. He wrote it exactly as it happened, language and all. Years ago I met Rod Hutchinson at a talk and had a proper chat with him, he is exactly that, but his knowledge was amazing.

I must admit I've not read hutchies books but I prefer to read a book that is written how it happened with  No airs or Graces . For me the, the best book I've read is Micky gray's book "a merry olde dance" because it is written as it happened.  Looks like I must have to try and get a couple of Rod's books. 

[yonny]

3 minutes ago, emmcee said:

I must admit I've not read hutchies books

They're great imo. He is a carp anglers carp angler, he enjoys it for what it is, as well as having the "the knowledge".

4 minutes ago, emmcee said:

Micky gray

I was listening to the latest Korda podcast and they mentioned that they have one with Micky coming up. Looking forward to that, he never seems to do anything like that.

I agree, his books are brilliant.

[bluelabel]

Last night (well... early hours of this morning actually) I finished Bernard Venables'  "The Gentle Art Of Angling".

I mentioned in another thread that I had obtained a copy (1st edition) and was asked to give a review.... (Here is as good a place as any)

Having mentioned on first glance, that it appeared very "wordy", almost verbose, I can conclude that on completion of the book, my original premise was correct...

There were words I have never even heard of let alone understood (and I am quite well read, with an excellent vocabulary)

I made a point to keep my phone handy to look up some of the words used in his musings...  The chapters that describe the psychological makeup of an angler (and his choice of Mate) were bordering upon hilarious, but were not meant to be...

You have to understand that this tome is of a period,  published in 1955 (3 years before I was born) and as such the style of writing has an almost comedic feel given today's attitudes... Almost as if one were watching "The Fast Show's" Miles Cholmondley Warner sketches... (I have my good lady to thank for that somewhat concise analogy after she read a page)

All in all, not a book to take seriously, it has a passing interest to those of a certain age and one of the things that tickled mightily was the reference to the "Un-named" "Prophet/High Priest of Carp Angling" who holds (held) the British record Carp of 44lbs and his "Disciples of The Carp Catchers Club"

The emphasis is definitely on Game fishing and I have to say, it didn't really hold me for very long at any time, jauntily (but unintentionally) humorous and very easy to dip in and out of....

 

 

   

Edited April 29, 2020 by bluelabel

[salokcinnodrog]

4 hours ago, emmcee said:

I must admit I've not read hutchies books but I prefer to read a book that is written how it happened with  No airs or Graces . For me the, the best book I've read is Micky gray's book "a merry olde dance" because it is written as it happened.  Looks like I must have to try and get a couple of Rod's books. 

I still read and reread The Carp Strikes Back. It covers a lot of his original bait thoughts, much of which is still pertinent today, even in todays Bait Market.

With that though is the humour and warts and all of session fishing on Savay, the highs and lows, some rig and lead set-ups, and other trips.

 

 

[greekskii]

for me the best bit of carp fishing writing I have ever read is a chapter in Subsurface Journal 2. The Edges of Places by Matt Beddows. I have read a lot of angling books and this chapter actually does something that none of the others do. I could read it back to back a few times a day and still be captivated by the words. This chapter stoked my interest to fish a quarry I had known about for a while but not looked around and I read it 4/5 times a year to keep my fire burning for all my angling. 

I would very much recommend getting a copy of SSJ2 (if you can find one for a good price) just for this chapter alone!

[Guest StinkyMink]

22 hours ago, bluelabel said:

So.... not being contentious here... but he's sold a lot of books, a lot of folks love his books and writing style, and he's been a British Carp record holder... and your qualifications are.....? 

Fine to say you don't like his style, but to dismiss his work out of hand smacks of narrow mindedness... 

Yes you are actually

Does catching a very big carp automatically qualify you to have a talent for writing?

I'm a qualified journalist, and that qualifies me to say that I don't like the guys overinflated ego and writing style (not that I need qualifications to give opinions)

I am not a Chris Yates worshipper and never will be, I heard some stories about his antics at Redmire. If you choose to believe the hype and worship people that's up to you. But don't tell me to and not expect a bit of comeback because you were very rude actually calling me ''narrow minded''

 

 

 

 

 

11 hours ago, salokcinnodrog said:

 

Rod Hutchinson on the other hand, by his own admission was not a writer. He wrote it exactly as it happened, language and all. Years ago I met Rod Hutchinson at a talk and had a proper chat with him, he is exactly that, but his knowledge was amazing.

He said because he was being humble that but his writing is actually completely and utterly brilliant.

 

 

People get confused about what good writing actually is. It is not Chris Yates pretentious, poetic airy fairy drivel, it is the plain, to the point, uncluttered, flowing beautifully good storytelling and plain speak of people like Rod which is the good writing I have been on about

And it is not rushed either, and full of wonderful stories

Crow, Chilcott, Cundiff - their writing is rushed and poorly constructed because they just spiel it off the top of their head

Rod just has a talent for writing which they don't, which is why he is a genuine legend and they are mereley very well known

All I have tried to get across is a simple point, that many people don't even know what good writing looks like

 

11 hours ago, yonny said:

several generations of carp anglers can't be wrong.

I know LOADS of people who don't like Terry Hearn, or his books

He aint no God in my eyes mate and never will be..

Edited April 29, 2020 by StinkyMink

[emmcee]

5 hours ago, StinkyMink said:

 

I'm a qualified journalist, and that qualifies me to say that I don't like the guys overinflated ego and writing style (not that I need qualifications to give opinions)

 

 

 

 

 

We all have opinions,  that is what makes a great forum. No ones opinion is correct over someone else's. Just because one person likes one thing it doesn't mean that someone else should or will like it as well. They are only opinions and someone's opinion is worth the same as someone else's. 

We all like different things, luckily, as if we all like the same things it would be a boring world. 

 

5 hours ago, StinkyMink said:

I know LOADS of people who don't like Terry Hearn, or his books

He aint no God in my eyes mate and never will be..

I've got to ask, what is it about terry that these people don't like? I've personally never met or fished with  a more quiet or placid a person. In my 30 years of carp fishing I've got to say I've never heard a bad word said against him. 

[framey]

To be fair 

all these people are anglers who have written a book not writers who fish.

i think maybe the publishers are to blame in not getting them proof read before release.

but in all these cases it all boils down to money as with most things in the tackle trade “just get it out attitude”

 

Edited April 29, 2020 by framey

[yonny]

4 minutes ago, framey said:

all these people are anglers who have written a book not writers who fish.

This^^^^

Writing skills don't bother me in the slightest. As long as it's written with passion.

I'll read Steven King if I want a well written book. I'll read Terry Hearn if I want some angling inspiration.

[bluelabel]

Well to be honest, all I've heard is Mr Mink's self professed writing skills... and his decrying of others... lets see some of your's Sir... let us decide

we all have our likes and dislikes, but just because I dislike someones work, it does does not entitle me to decry their work as rubbish.

As for me being rude... I never called Yates's works Waffle or Drivel... qualified or not, that is rudeness...

As I have said before, his book sales bear testimony to his writing prowess, as do the various publications which have favourably reviewed his work...

If it were utter pants there wouldn't be a huge following of his work... and whilst I'd be the first to agree that not all of his work is of the standard of "The Secret Carp" or "The Deepening Pool" or "Casting At The Sun" he commands good sales... Do you ?

As a case in point Rod Hutchinson said once that he could never aspire to the same writing ability of his mate, "but here goes" and yes, Rods work is good... But, as Framey says, there's a difference between an angler who writes and a writer who fishes... and Rod falls firmly into the first group.

 

Edited April 29, 2020 by bluelabel

[bluelabel]

28 minutes ago, yonny said:

This^^^^

Writing skills don't bother me in the slightest. As long as it's written with passion.

I'll read Steven King if I want a well written book. I'll read Terry Hearn if I want some angling inspiration.

I recently read a self published diary of a friends fishing life... was it well written? well probably not, it needed a proof reading or three and a bit of editing, but as an Angling Journal it made fantastic reading...

[Guest StinkyMink]

1 hour ago, bluelabel said:

there's a difference between an angler who writes and a writer who fishes... and Rod falls firmly into the first group.

 

Hutchinson is 50 times the writer Yates is

[bluelabel]

yeah okay.... In your own opinion 

[Guest StinkyMink]

Thread not getting anywhere because nobody has taken anybody up on their suggestions so it has become a bit biccery

 

I did try and look up Jack Hilton on somebodys reccomendation, but it was out of my price range. I will pick it up at Christmas bonus time!

Does anybody know of Mike Wilson's writing much?

His ''Carp Fishing Legends'' book is very good. He stood out from the pack (apart from the John Harry one which was also excellent). I have only read half of them, the Albert Romp and Lee Jackson ones are not great.

[Its-grim-up-north]

23 hours ago, StinkyMink said:

A big ego doesn't automatically mean you can write well!

You don’t say...🤔

[salokcinnodrog]

5 hours ago, StinkyMink said:

I'm a qualified journalist, and that qualifies me to say that I don't like the guys overinflated ego and writing style (not that I need qualifications to give opinions)

 

In that case, put your tin hat on, because journalists have no writing skills, do not know how to make a point or even write decent English.

 

Do me a favour, don't write 3 or 4 posts, put it all into one. The grief it causes the moderators and myself having to merge a series of posts into one.

 

As for Terry Hearn, I've been around a bit, never found anyone with one exception who has a bad word to say about Terry Hearn. Many anglers got into carp fishing because of him and his writings. He is not overinflated, does not have an ego, is the nicest guy going. He talks because that is his nature. He shows his enthusiasm for fishing, his writing, his slideshows.

[crusian]

On 28/04/2020 at 15:04, bluelabel said:

Try some of Yates's books... awesome writer

Hello Blue

I also love Chris Yates's books , the only one I struggled with is Nightwalk , but I'll try again one day .

😃