ouchthathurt

you can use a whipping knot to tie hair rigs - the same knot you would use to tie a spade end hook on, just adding a loop to the tag end. i wouldnt be happy using washing up liquid as its smell and chemical make up may be off putting, there are better flouros to use as they are designed especially for hooklinks, using tiny amounts of rig putty can also help.

the helicopter rig is probably the best rig to use with leadcore, especially if you splice a loop in the end you attach your main line to. leadcore should NEVER be knotted to the mainline, unless you are using a needle knot which is small enough to allow the hooklink swivel to pass over safely. the hooklink swivel needs to be a "big bore" variety, preferably one with a large ring on it which you pass down the leadcore. there was a "fashion" for a time, to thread the top bead onto the leadcore sideways using a baiting needle, now THIS IS dangerous as it cannot pass freely up the line. which will tether the hooklink to the leadcore. i use leadcore often, always with a helicopter rig, i dont agree with leadclips and leadcore, as i dont think this is safe, as regardless of whether the lead has ejected or not, the carp is still attached to a length of hooklink and a length of leadcore. when you consider the average hooklink breaking strain for braided hooklinks is about 20lb, and the average leadcore leader breaking strain is double that, at about 40lb, (ESP being 45lb) this is quite a substantial strength "tether" should a trailing carp become snagged - yet the lead may have ejected as designed. the most common length for leadcore is usually several feet, so if you picture the scene, you have a leadcore leader of several feet with a leadclip and a coated braided hooklink, a common enough rig i'm sure you will agree. you get a take, you snap off, the lead ejects as designed, the carp heads for the safety of the snags, as they do, (the leads gone, remember) the carp makes it inot the snag, thick branches, weeds etc, trailing a 20lb hooklink and several feet of leadcore, which snares on the snag as it passes, (no lead remember!) the fish panics, becomes tangled and is now stuck. with a "fish safe" leadclip... with the helicopter rig, the line snaps, the lead, securely tied to the end of the leadcore, snags up, the top bead pops off under the pressure and the hooklink slides up the tethered leadcore and slides off the end, now the carp swims off with just a hooklink to get rid of. - provided the helicopter rig is tied properly to begin with. when i tie mine, i get a length of leadcore, tie on a lead to one end, splice a loop in the oter end. i then slide a helicopter buffer bead down over the lead followed by my rig, tied to a ring swivel, but the hooklink NOT tied to the ring, but to the other end. as the ring will be going down the leadcore leader. once the hooklink is threaded on the leader, i then thread on a 1cm length of shrink tube, and shrink it down about 1-2" above the top of the buffer bead. once this is shrunk down, i slip another 1cm length of shrink tube over the 1st, and shrink that down too. then finally, i slide the top bead down it sits on the shrink tube. the safety test is simple. hold your hooklink in one hand and your lead in the other. drop the lead and if the bead pops off and the hooklink travels up the leadcore leader and over the top, then its ok to use. if the hooklink hits the top bead and does not move, then find a top bead with a larger bore, until the merest jarring of the hooklink causes the top bead to pop off. then if/when you snap off, when the carp picks up the bait and shakes its head, the top bead pops off and leaves the hooklink to travel freely up the line. there is one very simple rule, if you are in ANY doubt, dont use the rig, if you are not used to leadcore or are in any doubting your rig, use tubing. there are many varieties of tubing that is as good as leadcore, anchor rigtube being one. never put the fish at risk because you are unsure to the rigs "safetiness"

i'm assuming that this lake is owned/bailliffed by someone? that you have had to make contact with someone linked with said lake and hand over the readies? your best bet is to emails or call the lake owners/baillifs and ask them, they will know what to expect and will (should anyway) want you to get the best out of your trip, the best advice is local advice mate. you see, i could tell you to tip n 50Kg straight off, yet the carp might spook off 1kg of bait over the spot, wihout speaking to people who know the place, you really cant guess. make the wrong decision and its a lot of wasted bait/money/time/trip for poor rewards. remember the old saying, you can put more in, but you cant take it out again.

no dramas mate, what we are all here for after all. i know different anglers have different opinions on the palm test, but it gives me confidence and its not doing any harm, so where is the problem there? i have read from some "big name" anglers in magazines that the palm test is irrelevant but it makes me happy so thats that. regardless of hook or rig choice, you are looking for that "flipability" so it spins and finds a hookhold as soon as the carp takes the bait.

to be honest, you dont really need the tubing with kurv shanked hooks. the concept behind the curv-shanx was that the hook flipped over as the hooklink tightened in the carps mouth finding a hookhold, which was the reason why shrink tubing was used over the eye of the hook on long shanks/other patterns, for this "hook flipping" it all stems from the original idea behind the "bent hook" rg which was used a lot in the 80s-90s which was a long shanked hook, like an aberdeen pattern or o'shaunessy bent at a 45 degree angle about 1/2 way up the hookshank, then tied in a knotless knot and hair rig arrangement presented a really agressive angle, but did cause some serious mouth damage and is now since banned on many (if not all) waters. you can use a tiny section to pin the hair to the hookshank,like i do. the way i fish them is to choose my chosen braided hooklink, - they are not as good with mono hooklinks - but thats just me, tie a loop in the braid for your hair loop, thread my chosen bottom bait/boilie onto it - so i can accuratley measure the hair. then i get a small piece of shrink tube, thread this onto the braided link, then thread the hook through this tubing, hookpoint 1st. so this leaves you with a length of braid with a boilie attached and and a hook attached to the braid by a length of shrink tube, but not yet tied on. i like relatively long hair lengths, so i measure out my chosen length and place the rig tube so it sits on the bend of the hook, i want the tubing to sit oppasite the eye, if that makes sense, then i tie the knotless knot as normal with the braid coming out through the front of the eye. if you imagine the eye of the kurv-shanx hook as the top and the gape of the hook as the bottom, then the shrink tube sits at the gape of the hook directly below the eye of the hook. does this make sense? then i have a hair length of 0.5" from gape of hook to top of bait. then once everything is set, i steam the shrink tube down into place and its job done. as you drag the rig over the palm of your hand, or dangle it over your finger and pull it back, you will see that as soon as the hook encounters resistance, it flips over and digs in. i find having the hair in this arrangement makes it more "flippable" as it works best when the hook encounters resistance, a semifixed/helicopter rig arrangement works best. ouch.

esp raptors for my bottom bait presentations. the short shanked, beaked point inturned eye type - with rig tubing, curved slightly inwards, they can be used on braided hooklinks for small pop ups too. JRC do a pattern that is a long shank, inturned eye with a slight Kurv-shank appearance, they are good for pop ups but make really good universal hooks. kamasan B175 heavy pattern fly hooks were my favourite for a very long time, but cannot find a stockist of them at the moment. ESP do a Kurv-shank pattern that i use for pop ups and snowman rigs, but i love the use of shrink tubing, where as curv-shanks do not really require shrink tube. as a footnote, none of these are barbless as i prefer barbed hooks. i do have one pack of barbless ESP curv-shanks for waters that insist on their use, i find a curved shank presentation is the best barbless pattern as they tend not to move about or pull out as much as other barbless patterns tend to.

i'd love to take you up on the offer, but i'm in afghanistan then on tour... ouch

i'm in dorset - what are you looking for? where in dorset? ouchthathurt

the lead that is good to use is a "tri-lobe" lead - they do not sink as fast due to their shape, and "plane" down to rest on the silt. pop up foam is a good addition, as it will suspend the hookbait above the silt for the length of time it takes for the foam to dissolve - where it will sink gently to rest on the silt rather than be pulled in deep behind a deep diving lead. - longer hooklinks are important in silt to preven the ame thing happening. ouchthathurt

many thanks. ouchthathurt

i dont see the difficulty in tying it, agreed, i just dont see the point of it. my rigs work fine, so i tend not to want to change what works for me. each to their own at the end of the day, so long as we are all happy with what we do, then its all good. ouchthathurt

i used to tie a length of dental floss to the eye of the lead and then the other end of the floss about 3ft up the line, so i had a length of dental floss running tight parralell to the line for the last few feet, then cast on tight line so when the lead sank into the silt, it would stain the dental floss so i could see the depth of the silt and make sure my hook links were long enough... i find that the problem with fishing over silt is that it has to be the right silt, not the thick black stinking rotting stuff as the carp do tend to avoid this as it does not hold any foodstuffs the light, fluffy "ouderless" silt is what your aiming for - looking for carp fizzing over it will give the game away, particles like hemp and pellet are good for silt as it has the carp rooting for hours looking for the particles, with dry boilies, when they adsorb the water when immersed, they can take on the flavour of the silt, which can make them unnattractive - so if you soak them in a booster, or better still the lake water or the water you used to boil the hemp, until they cannot adsorb anymore water, then they will hold their flavour better and resist the taste and smell of silt better as the baits cannot adsorb anymore water - plus they appear washed out which for pressured carp can be a real edge. shaun harrison called them "rehrydrates" and used them to good effect at the mangrove, a lake with metres of silt in places! the use of PVA nuggets on the hooklink to suspend the hook is a good idea, i used to buy old 1-2oz (lead) sea leads and lead sarsely bombs and hammer my leads flat, then rough the edges up so they sank slower, so they were less likely to bury deep into the silt, then by using the pva nuggets, the hookbait would remain suspended until the pva dissolved, then the hookbait would gently sink and rest on the silt, especially if using critically balanced baits. naturals such as maggots are good over bloodworm beds found in silt, i find braided hooklinks such as silkworm the best for use in silt, with running leds, but not inlines as they bury nose first inot the silt and drag the hooklink in with it. also dont forget the margins! i often find it easier to find clear, hard spots in the margins, and all carp love to explore and feed in the margins. also an edge if everybody else is casing out to the clay spots in the middle..., hope this helps. ouchthathurt

another "fashionable rig then... can see what knorty is saying, the KD rig is designed to make the rig act "point heavy" so as it is being sucked into the carps mouth boilie first, the hook is "supposed" to hang so the hook is near-upside down? this would mean the hook is hanging as a grappling hook almost, so if a point heavy hook was to be dragged accross the outside of the carps mouth on its way in, then it is conceivable that it could hook up on the outside of the carps mouth. after all the hook is following the boilie as it is propelled out of its mouth. so surely its conceivable that the hook will act the same regardless of which way its being sucked/blown as it is being forced in a particular direction by the propulsion of the boilie. the KD rig is designed to be point heavy - so the point is designed to drop into the floor of the mouth, and the point to hang low down to snare in the bottom lip, floor of mouth, surely if this action is snaring fish on the way out, as the hook point is hanging so it is the lowest point of the rig, then the same action would be true when it is being sucked in? when the hook point would (perhaps) drag along the chin and hook up. if i'm honest, i couldnt give a monkeys about these so - called wonder-rigs, i find good bait application in the right location is much more important, you can catch a carp that is not there, no matter how hi-tec the rig is, i think the more hi-tec rigs are to catch anglers and make money - in my experience, the more hi-tec the rig is, the more likely it is to fail. i've used the simple silkworm - knotless knot - ESP/JRC hook for years, sometimes with the addition of shrinktube to flip the hook, which has always outfished the complicated hi-tec rigs i've used. i went through a phase where i hadnt been fishing for a while due to work/family commitments. when i got back onto the lake, i struggled to get a fish, so convinced my rigs were at fault, so i trawled the mags and tied up all these complicated wonder-rigs and all i did was get increasingly more confused with each rig change, on the end my confidence was shot, i didnt know what i was doing, what would work, nothing - but i had the best hi-tec in vouge wonder-rig by the mags, so surely that couldnt be it? maybe it was my location? - no, there were carp over my spots, the bait? no it was a bait i had used lots of time in the past to brilliant success, so what was it? i reeled in and looked at my rigs and they were rediculous, shot and tubing and rings and swivels everywhere - but the magazines had raved about these rigs as the next best thing since sliced bread, but in the cold light of day - on the bank in a real life situation, they looked clownlike, cluttered, a useless mess really! so i cut them off, tied up simple knotless knot hair-rigs on silkworm, to simple running rigs, exactly the same rigs i'd started with over 12yrs before - and had been using ever since - as they worked a treat, cast back tothe spots and finally, the alarm went into its warcry - i started to catch again, the bait and location were the same, but the rigs were different, the ironic thing is, if i had looked back to my previous successes on this rig/bait combination, then i should have had the confidence to stick to my guns and ride out the blanks safe in the knowledge that they worked, and worked well, but i fell into the trap of believing that my rigs were at fault and i needed to "upgrade" them to the wonder-rig of the day, which ended up destroying my confidence and doing much more harm than good, that was about 3yrs ago, and i still use the exact same type of rigs now, and have done really well on them wherever i've taken them. its the correct bait application and the correct location that will produce the goods, not the spinning/cutting/blowback/flipper/rythymisadancer rig. in fact, i can think of many occassions when i have been tempted to use more compicated rigs than the situation dictated - because the mags say its the wonder-rig when the simple rig would have been much better - and my catches have suffered as a result. i now refine my basic rigs to suit, silkworm or amnesia - shrinktube or not, and i'm happy with my success rate now. ouchthathurt

sure thing

if i'm honest - no, i used to drive past it a lot and i know of many anglers who raved about it, i can be very fussy at times, when i get a pond in my minds eye, i just have to empty it. broadlands seems to have a good reputation around these parts - as does todber. i'm on a gorgeous small peaceful farm pond with caught fish to mid 20s and uncaught fish to approx 30+ ouchthathurt

do not jest those with the skill and training who know how... hell what do i know? i'm a medic!!! ouchthathurt

yeah your right, i still like to test all my rigs by laying them in the margin beforehand, sometimes we can really overcomplicate matters. theres something that gives you a good feeling when you look at your rig in the margin and it looks good, it really does help. ouchthathurt

i tend to just hair rig my pop ups using a fine mono hair and micro needles, i tend not to worry about pop ups up staying up for 24hrs+ my sessions are only about 6-8hrs long... secondly, a pop up that dont float is a critically balanced bait is it not? i do like to test my pop ups both on casting and on retrieval, to make sure they are still floating. however we do need to be mindful of wether the pop ups are really floating as we would like in the lake - what with all that water pressure bearing down on it. it is easy - and perhaps wrong, to assume the pop up behaves the same way in 10feet of water as it does in 1ft of margins where water pressure is much less. ouchthathurt.

nash, what type of secret bait then? (dont worry i signed the official secrets act along with the UKSF disclosure accord... ) ouchthathurt

thrust and parried there RAF man, i guess i should take my DPM non interservice winners backside and lower my head and slink on out of here... i suppose when i dont have a leg to stand on i sholud back down!!! seriously, well done on the title pal. (choke choke) regards, ouchthathurt

broadlands lake in hants does a forces discount, plus go mid week and get an extra 24hrs free - check their website. ouchthathurt

no worries. ouchthathurt

yeah, buckshole is a chavhole, best avoided i suppose, spoon is on the top of west hill in hastings (i think) best bet is to call the hastings tackleshops and get the details. (was either redfearns or SH tackle) your willing to travel, then maybe getting a cemex ticket and hoofing it up the m25 to kingsmead etc? i used to do the wraysbury trip to from hastings, not too bad from hove - reading area is kingsmead after all, hawkhurst fish farm is an option as well, or else get into hants along he m27, lots of clubs/syndicates that way, best thing i get googling and find what you fancy. i'm in dorset now, so out of touch with sussex scene. ouchthathurt

i take it us army guys are not invited regards, ouchthathurt

where abouts in sussex? i'm originally from hastings, there was always the spoon, which as lotsa swims, carp to nudging 30s and 250quid. lovely looking water. i used to fish buckshole resivior in alexandria park - rough a hell, club ticket, but my fave lake to date... nearly!