Rig ejection

[framey]

If going to go down the minute details 

what about noise vibration travelling down the line lol

might as well just throw away the rods and take up golf 

[elmoputney]

  On 26/06/2020 at 10:15, framey said:

If going to go down the minute details 

what about noise vibration travelling down the line lol

might as well just throw away the rods and take up golf 

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I just read a post on fb about underlit alarms causing light to go down the line as well  😳😳😳😳 

[framey]

I give up then lol

[yonny]

  On 26/06/2020 at 10:32, elmoputney said:

underlit alarms causing light to go down the line

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🤣😂That's a new one to me.

All this stuff (sound/light travelling down line/inherent magnetism of metals) is why people end up with their heads up their backsides.

There really is not that much to worry about in carp angling:

Present a bait well..... in an area the carp are prepared to feed..... when the carp are there, feeding.

If we're not catching, 9 times out of 10 it is because one of the above requirements has not been met. The other 1 time out of 10 has nothing to do with sound/light travelling down line or inherent magnetism of metals imo. It is due to some other environmental factor that can normally be determined by careful and comprehensive observation. 

If the people that come up with these crazy theories spent as much time trying to present a bait well in an area the carp are prepared to feed when the carp are there feeding, they would become a very good angler very quickly. Imo.

[carpepecheur]

  On 26/06/2020 at 09:56, yonny said:

Personally I just don't think it needs to be there. Any half decent rig that resets itself will do the job if the feeding situation is fostered effectively imo.

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I agree that the feeding situation needs to be created. There is nothing is like the 100% confidence you get when you see bubbles coming up from your patch. It seemed to me that the tone of this thread was to suggest improvements to the anti-ejection properties of a rig rather than just accept current rigs.

IMHO, I think the problem with a lot of rigs is that the hook simply hangs below the bait. All the carp has to do is to open its mouth and let it drop. I think the solution is to try and make the hook move away from that position once the carp stops sucking it up.

This is why I do not fish my boilies on a hair BUT, because the hair is a very tried and tested technique, I think the “Savay” idea may be the way to go.

[yonny]

  On 26/06/2020 at 11:36, carpepecheur said:

It seemed to me that the tone of this thread was to suggest improvements to the anti-ejection properties of a rig

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It has gone on a bit of a tangent hasn't it lol.

  On 26/06/2020 at 11:36, carpepecheur said:

I think the “Savay” idea may be the way to go.

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If you try it you must give us feedback👍

[carpepecheur]

I wasn't planning to try it as I am happy with my current rig but that sounds like a challenge. I was just trying to give a helpful suggestion BUT will have to give it a go now. I will tank test it first to see how it sucks up. There are a lot of variables - length of whisker, stiffness and thickness of whisker, number of whiskers, angle between whiskers. 

I have a mental image of it being a bit like having a small fishbone stuck in your throat. 

 

[salokcinnodrog]

  On 26/06/2020 at 07:08, bluelabel said:

it a sight thing, or a detection of magnetic field...?

 having watched carp spook off my rigs in the margins its hard to say, but when you use multiple metal components in rigs (and often different metals) I think the latter may be true to a degree...

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  On 26/06/2020 at 09:58, bluelabel said:

this is my point... I 'm wondering if the mix of metals in rig components is causing a low level (either) magnetic or electrical field that the fish can detect, we all know that some fish can detect electrical muscle impulses of fish hiding in sand in the sea... who's to say freshwater fish cannot detect the same fields from metal mixes in rig components... as you said yourself, "they know something is different"  you said that yourself, but do you know what they are spooking at... really...??? 

 

this is the point I'm trying to get across

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  On 26/06/2020 at 10:11, yonny said:

Every single carp that has ever been caught on rod and line was hooked on a piece of metal bro.

All fish can detect electrical impulses - but a piece of metal cannot give off an impulse. It can have an inherent level of magnetism, but it cannot give off an impulse.

We can agree to disagree but imo if fish could distinguish metals none of us would ever have caught a carp in our lives.

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A couple of Interesting thoughts on this;

Years ago Mike Wilson was convinced that the different metals on the end tackle created an electrical field. Steel hook, copper or steel on the lead. Basically from my limited understanding, the dissimilar metals with an electrolyte like water between them create a tiny electrical and magnetic field.

Mike Wilson was so convinced, he was playing about creating weights made of glass.

  On 26/06/2020 at 07:36, emmcee said:

This is also where having an established bait that the carp want can give you a massive edge and creating a feeding area/ situation that brings numbers of fish to your spot. The more your hookbait is picked up the more chance of a take naturally. 

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  On 26/06/2020 at 09:56, yonny said:

No idea mate.

Personally I just don't think it needs to be there. Any half decent rig that resets itself will do the job if the feeding situation is fostered effectively imo.

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There are more posts on this that I could or even should have quoted, unfortunately as I'm trying to keep it relevant on (page 1), and pushing the + symbol would quote every post complete, I can't add them in.

 

The resetting rigs is an important point, but the more we can create a comfortable feeding situation, where the fish are actively feeding, then with a rig that is ejected, the same or another fish can carry on feeding, and take the rig again, hopefully at some point being hooked. An 'inefficient' rig on comfortably feeding fish can still hook them, whereas an efficient rig with non feeding fish probably or possibly won't. In effect the carp have to take the hookbait in either scenario.

 

 

 

 

[sir axeman]

Does anybody fish the hair rig? By that I mean the original concept...1lb line 2" hair to give your bait a chance of behaving more like a freebie? I'm starting to think of using it again after many years of short hairs of the same material as the hooklink ie a continuation of (usually via a knotless knot). 

 

I need to start doing something different as I'm blanking when I have fish all around me and I cover a couple of feeding spells in my session time on the bank. I often backlead as much to pin the lines down close in so as not to be in the way of the other rod when playing a fish in the margins....as well for the line being pinned down round the baited areas.  Sometimes I'll get 2 bleeps and I think is that a liner between my tip and the backlead or have I just been done. (I often fear the latter is the case!).

[salokcinnodrog]

  On 01/07/2020 at 17:59, sir axeman said:

Does anybody fish the hair rig? By that I mean the original concept...1lb line 2" hair to give your bait a chance of behaving more like a freebie? I'm starting to think of using it again after many years of short hairs of the same material as the hooklink ie a continuation of (usually via a knotless knot). 

 

I need to start doing something different as I'm blanking when I have fish all around me and I cover a couple of feeding spells in my session time on the bank. I often backlead as much to pin the lines down close in so as not to be in the way of the other rod when playing a fish in the margins....as well for the line being pinned down round the baited areas.  Sometimes I'll get 2 bleeps and I think is that a liner between my tip and the backlead or have I just been done. (I often fear the latter is the case!).

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10mm gap between boilie and hook, often with hair made of dental floss.

I usually use a sliding rig ring on the hookshank to tie the hair to.

 

I think I made the backlead point on another thread, they reduce indication, ditch them. 

 

*edit*

 

Edited July 1, 2020 by salokcinnodrog

[sir axeman]

I think with the backlead thing you might have a point!! 

[elmoputney]

  On 01/07/2020 at 19:10, sir axeman said:

I think with the backlead thing you might have a point!! 

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I would lose the back leads too, just take more time sinking your line and if you aren't fishing at distance I would fish a slacker line rather than a back lead, I put my line into the line clip on my rod , to increase the angle on the bobbins, I feel this gives me better indication, also and much better control on how the line lays out the rod tip, 

 

 

[Carpmaster]

We get done all the time lol good job us lot are good at camping 😄😄

[yonny]

  On 01/07/2020 at 17:59, sir axeman said:

I need to start doing something different as I'm blanking when I have fish all around me

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What rig are you currently using buddy?

It is always best to change something for a specific reason. You think you're getting done which goes part way towards giving you that reason, but it is important to understand why you think your current rig is letting you down to make sense of any change.

[Carpmaster]

  On 02/07/2020 at 07:03, yonny said:

What rig are you currently using buddy?

It is always best to change something for a specific reason. You think you're getting done which goes part way towards giving you that reason, but it is important to understand why you think your current rig is letting you down to make sense of any change.

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[Carpmaster]

This is my current set up nothing fancy but it works well for me in a pva bag 

[elmoputney]

  On 02/07/2020 at 07:51, Carpmaster said:

This is my current set up nothing fancy but it works well for me in a pva bag 

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Just a question why are you using an extra swivel, and a quick link? 

Why not streamline it down and just use one swivel? 

Edited July 2, 2020 by elmoputney

[Carpmaster]

Only had them components at time of making.  Now I've been to the tackle shop and have the one chick change swivel with the silicone sleeve 

[elmoputney]

  On 02/07/2020 at 08:02, Carpmaster said:

Only had them components at time of making.  Now I've been to the tackle shop and have the one chick change swivel with the silicone sleeve 

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I just use a ring swivel and loop my rig on, I prefer not to use sleeves in a bag, as I want the rig to be as natural as possible, but if it works for you  👍

Edited July 2, 2020 by elmoputney

[carpepecheur]

  On 02/07/2020 at 07:51, Carpmaster said:

This is my current set up nothing fancy but it works well for me in a pva bag 

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Are you saying that you put the lead inside the PVA bag as well?

[Carpmaster]

Yes I do 

[Carpmaster]

I dont find any problem I've even had a look with the fish spy it looks pucka 

[sir axeman]

  On 02/07/2020 at 07:03, yonny said:

What rig are you currently using buddy?

It is always best to change something for a specific reason. You think you're getting done which goes part way towards giving you that reason, but it is important to understand why you think your current rig is letting you down to make sense of any change.

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I use a multi tangle rig.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Just kidding lol...just a simple 10" coated braid with the last 2" peeled off by the hook with a 6 hook with a bit of shrink tubing to give a "bent hook" effect. Short hair from the braid knotless knot. 2oz lead (max on this water) with a safety bead on to give a semi fixed effect and about 12" of quick sink rig tubing behind the lead...pretty standard rig I guess.

 

I used to use mono hooklengths...ESP Soft Ghost (flourocarbon) but it still feels pretty stiff n wirey to me so haven't used it in a while. Got some drennan half strength (double strength 😉) that I might use for hooklink soon tis much thinner than a regular 10lb mono. 

 

 

Edited July 2, 2020 by sir axeman

[yonny]

  On 02/07/2020 at 09:57, sir axeman said:

I use a multi tangle rig.

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lol

  On 02/07/2020 at 09:57, sir axeman said:

a simple 10" coated braid with the last 2" peeled off by the hook with a 6 hook with a bit of shrink tubing to give a "bent hook" effect. Short hair from the braid knotless knot. 2oz lead (max on this water) with a safety bead on to give a semi fixed effect and about 12" of quick sink rig tubing behind the lead

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Imo there is absolutely nothing wrong with that mate. I don't believe an old school hair will fix any problem you associate with the rig.

When you say safety bead do you mean a lead clip? Or some other type?

Assume you're using it with a bottom bait or wafter?

What is the substrate on the spots you're fishing? Is there much weed, silt or chod about?

[carpepecheur]

  On 02/07/2020 at 09:52, Carpmaster said:

Yes I do 

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It is possible that when the lead hits the water, the momentum in the lead pushes through the lighter contents of the bag and sits on top of your rig. When you retrieve the lead, it pulls clear and everything looks normal. Of course if your fish spy tells you your multi tangle rig 😀 is normal then you have a different problem. Does it not give you any other clues what might be happening like fish shying away or picking up and dropping?

Edited July 2, 2020 by carpepecheur