Washed out baits

[stephenwright97]

I have read a couple of interesting articles about the success of washed out baits. The results seem good enough to give them a real good go. Anyone on here tried them? There was an interesting bit about washing out baits and putting them in a soak as normal and then using them...

[grangemilky]

I have. I would make sure you are doing it with a bait that they are used to seeing though. 

[stephenwright97]

Good point,one that I had not thought of....However, a busy lake will see all sorts of different baits, The texture of washed outs is so different and not associated with danger but your point is very valid and true. If a lake is seeing ten tons of Cell every weekend then washed out Cell would seem to be the answer, or would it? 

[newmarket]

It would depend on the lake i spose . How busy , how many carp , what stamp of carp etc .

 

I would hazard a guess that youd be sacrificing fresh new highly attractive fish-pulling bait in order to put out a load of washed outs that the fish may or may not happen across during the length of your session .

[blanksalot]

Re; washed out

 

If it's such an edge then why don't manufacturers make them this colour to start with ?

 

Seems the paler boilies like tiger nut, cell, etc will wash out, 

 

but have many of us have caught in the first few hours of arrival with a bait straight out of the bag ? so not even remotely washed out.

 

I think we are given these fish too much credit for being smarter than we think, after all they are pigs with fins 

 

Anyway i have some red fishmeal boilies that would'nt wash out if i bathed with them for a whole year 

 

So really the best bait colour to use should be white, yes?

 

sales of nash amber will rocket now 

[grangemilky]

Re; washed out

 

If it's such an edge then why don't manufacturers make them this colour to start with ?

 

Seems the paler boilies like tiger nut, cell, etc will wash out, 

 

but have many of us have caught in the first few hours of arrival with a bait straight out of the bag ? so not even remotely washed out.

 

I think we are given these fish too much credit for being smarter than we think, after all they are pigs with fins 

 

Anyway i have some red fishmeal boilies that would'nt wash out if i bathed with them for a whole year 

 

So really the best bait colour to use should be white, yes?

 

sales of nash amber will rocket now 

 

 

 

if they were that colour to start with, they wouldn't be washed out! Ever fished a big bed of boilies, and had a big hit around 24/48hs after baiting? Washing them out is only replicating that situation, but on day one. 

 

TBH if you are going to wash out baits, you want it to be baits that the fish see regularly, either because its something terrible, like the cell, or because you pre-bait it regularly. You need something that the fish will recognise as having been in the water for considerable time, and be much safer. 

IMO its a tactic only for low stocked places, on a well stocked place with a lot of smaller fish, its just a waste of time and money. 

[newmarket]

Great post

[grangemilky]

Great post

 

Might want to quote him, now it looks like you are saying that to me

[grangemilky]

Re; washed out

 

If it's such an edge then why don't manufacturers make them this colour to start with ?

 

Seems the paler boilies like tiger nut, cell, etc will wash out, 

 

but have many of us have caught in the first few hours of arrival with a bait straight out of the bag ? so not even remotely washed out.

 

I think we are given these fish too much credit for being smarter than we think, after all they are pigs with fins 

 

Anyway i have some red fishmeal boilies that would'nt wash out if i bathed with them for a whole year 

 

So really the best bait colour to use should be white, yes?

 

sales of nash amber will rocket now 

 

 

Washing out isn't just colour though. Baits that are soft, and swelled up aren't something that can be replicated out the bag. 

[blanksalot]

Washing out isn't just colour though. Baits that are soft, and swelled up aren't something that can be replicated out the bag.

 

You've never bought cheap nasty bait from ebay then 

[grangemilky]

you're right there!

[newmarket]

Actually i think they were both very good posts therefore i have left thins be but "liked" em both . Good debate .

[billybaltic]

Couldn't you just boil for less and drop a few mil of flavour etc. i know it's not the same but could give you that washed out sense.

[stephenwright97]

I have a sneaky feeling washed outs are very much about texture... It is so different. How long does the average angler stay in a swim? One maybe two nights. Not long enough to tell about using washed outs,especially if the swim is topped up during the session. Best time to use washed outs could be on Mondays and Tuesdays !! 

[johnplumb]

Now I don't know anything of bait making but I assuming it will lose its smell as well as look differant after sitting on a lake bed for a few days , isn't there a case for rolling boilies with the blandest ingredients you possibly can ? Just maybe the fish feel that they are safe because there is no smell to them

[stephenwright97]

Carp sense of smell is extremely strong. That is why most bait makers use very distinctive flavours and this has worked really well,thats why they sell so much of it. I think we have to consider the way carp feed on boilies, there sense of danger and what they associate with danger around boiled baits. Lets face it, on most carp waters boilies and pellets are like a natural food, the only thing they feed on (apart from particles and other human foodstuffs) that puts a hook in their mouth. So washed outs are end of session foods left over. No lines,no leads,no leaders just bait (unless the swim is permanently occupied and in this case i would never fish it). so going to a water with washed outs to begin with could (i say could) have an edge. I have managed to make washed out fishmeals with robin red and made hook baits using less robin red that mimick the washed outs in colour. Good thing about this they have remained stiffish so dont fall off the hair when cast at distance. The hook baits are balanced using some pop up mix. Going to give it a go on a two day session from tomorrow. All i want is an edge that puts a few more fish on the bank. If I can fish with three rods I will experiment as much as I can with two of them!,its interesting.

[stephenwright97]

One important thing with washed outs is they absorb water. When a new bait goes in it sucks in the smell of the lake bed. That is in itself a problem if the lake has that horrible muddy or silty smell. Reel your baits in on this kind of bottom after a couple of hours and they already have the tinge...Baits that have already been soaked in spring water( not tap it has all sorts in it) have already absorbed what they can hold,so they do not get soaked in the lake bed smell. This could ( i said could) be another edge,baits retaining their flavour. I also think that shallow soaking,with the water flavoured with the bait flavour would reduce attraction loss even further... There again I could be completely wrong, as I say the proof is in the doing not bashing out ideas on a keyboard..

[mooseman]

Grangemilky and blanksalot both make a lot of sense, but no one has mentioned yet, what happens to the ingredients of the bait, now all mixed together and beginning to chemically react with each other, when submerged in water over (For example) 2 days.

 

What happens biologically inside the bait over this time to make it different from frozen baits?

Does that make the bait more attractive to fish because the "Signals" coming off it are "Eat me"?

Are the signals from the bait more/less attractive to carp in the sense of them being edible or just considered safer?

Is the attraction actually coming from the immediate area of water around the bait, due to PH change, as a result of the bait being sat there?

 

IMHO its not just colour/texture or the lack of artificial flavours that needs to be considered...

[stephenwright97]

I like your train of thought Mooseman. I have not a clue what happens to the ingredients of the bait when its been submerged in water for two days,chemically react with each other? I cant even begin to think about the other points you make,but they do somehow seem relevant. The main point of washed outs is that they are less associated with danger by Mr carp for obvious reasons.Its that simple. However,I think your right,the whole profile of the bait must change. The reason I soak mine in spring water is to have them absorb all the water they can so that they do not take on the silt flavour I fish in. This works,its not foolproof but its good. I cant remember which carp guru suggested this but it was in an article on washed outs.

[newmarket]

[quote name="mooseman" post="228035" timestamp="

 

IMHO its not just colour/texture or the lack of artificial flavours that needs to be considered...

 

Its all about opinion . Mine is that it IS just about colour and texture

 

 

 

  

I like your train of thought Mooseman. I have not a clue what happens to the ingredients of the bait when its been submerged in water for two days,chemically react with each other? I cant even begin to think about the other points you make,but they do somehow seem relevant. The main point of washed outs is that they are less associated with danger by Mr carp for obvious reasons.Its that simple. However,I think your right,the whole profile of the bait must change. The reason I soak mine in spring water is to have them absorb all the water they can so that they do not take on the silt flavour I fish in. This works,its not foolproof but its good. I cant remember which carp guru suggested this but it was in an article on washed outs.

 

Thats a good one stephen .

Stands to reason that spring water is going to be more " neutral" than tap water what with no chlorine etc but i honestly believe the carp would rather your bait take on the silt after a while ....

Its where they feed naturally and though silt may smell repulsive to us , its their natural environment .

[stephenwright97]

This is a bit of a brainstormer.Good point Newmarket.... Mooseman has got me thinking. His comments have made me think about something else. Maybe we should be boiling our  baits in spring water or water from the lake were fishing....no additives and no horrible fluoride or chlorine...

[dalthegooner]

Surely you should be boiling using distilled water then which is pure H2O as there are also additives, albeit natural ones, in spring water.

[newmarket]

Surely you should be boiling using distilled water then which is pure H2O as there are also additives, albeit natural ones, in spring water.

Spot on again Dal mate . Its what i meant

[mooseman]

Glad I've got the old Grey matter working guys, that's what these forums are for after all. (Well, and for some people to ask what is the best boilie needle...)

 

I wouldn't be concerned about tap water being Impure, but yes it does have things in it that are not considered "Natural" I suppose. How do we know that they repel carp? Chlorine certainly doesn't.

 

There is so little taken into the bait during boiling, that it just doesn't concern me at all. However yes I would definitely choose other liquids to rehydrate/wash out bait over tap water.

 

I don't want to give away any underground secrets here and if anyone reading is already doing this kind of thing I apologise, but to keep the cogs turning over, there are one or two fruits whose juice might be worth adding to that pure water of yours! 

[salokcinnodrog]

I have read a couple of interesting articles about the success of washed out baits. The results seem good enough to give them a real good go. Anyone on here tried them? There was an interesting bit about washing out baits and putting them in a soak as normal and then using them...

I've let this ride, and not said anything about the topic, although I had thoughts, but was trying to marshal them into some sort of order so I could say what I think.

 

Washed out baits may work on a couple of levels;

The bait has been in the water for a couple of days, so it is safe to eat and not a pressure point that the carp feel they are eating freshly put in bait. If the pressure is so high that they don't eat baits that haven't been in the water a couple of day, then older 'washed out' baits may be the ones that are safe. It may also be that they would eat fresh baits if the amount of bait going in was enough so that they felt safe, whereas, they are leaving the new baits as they simply aren't safe.

 

It may also be that fresh baits could possibly be overloaded with flavours, and at introduction levels are so high that they repel!

 

I used to feel that on many high pressure weekend syndrome lakes, the fish do leave the baits introduced on Friday until Sunday at the earliest, and those that catch are those that are using washed out baits, small stringers, or even single hookbaits, different from those fishing over the large amount of spodded baits. 

 

If you prebait with enough bait that the carp are comfortable eating it, then I don't think that washed out baits are an advantage, and for my weekend trips, I do try to be different from the 'norm'. However, I do also think that fresh baits can be a danger to fish, and so I often use an older hookbait. I may start the trip with a hookbait, and use that same hookbait for a couple of days if it doesn't get pulled off the hair (fish or deterioration, which can be reduced by meshing hookbait ). I also bait up with fresh baits as my freebies. The hookbait is 'safe', the freebies are fresh and dangerous, the hookbait catches 'em.

 

Also it can be worth leaving a bait in place for a couple of days, again, you have to have confidence that it will stay on the hook/hair.

 

A few years ago, this washed out bait thing, I watched the carp ignoring sweetcorn that was fresh, until it had started to go a bit grey after a couple of days. The tench and the bream would eat it fresh (until a few were caught on it), and then they would avoid the area for a few days, (tench especially), but for the carp to take sweetcorn, it had to have been introduced a couple of days previously.

 

My main belief is simply that baits get left over a weekend, due to weekend syndrome, and a washed out bait may be better, but if fishing normally (midweek), pre-bait as much as possible, and you shouldn't need a washed out bait, except at the weekend when the pressure is usually highest