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Well the one I went to this morning has been closed, not sure why but the gates were shut with a sign up saying closed. Just been to another that's open, getting fencing put all around it and its free fishing until it's complete, so came home to get bedchair and bag, gonna do a night I think

How about an otter taking every carp (all 7 of them) in a water that is over 90 acres and over 35/40ft deep. That water contains bream (it’s done the record but not claimed, a number of times), tench, roach, perch, pike, and eels. This same lake has people walking around it every day of the year, sailing boats and bird watchers. It’s not a quiet lake. The otters have evolved into a species that doesn’t fear man like they used to. Is this down to being hand reared??? You cant compare eras in the same light when there are massive differences in the variables.

There are more carp in our lakes and waterways than ever before. Lakes that were once mixed fisheries are being netted for Tench,Bream silvers, to create "Carp" waters, all in the name of business.... If, as a businessman, you wish to cross swords with nature itself, then expect the unexpected. The rules of business mean nothing to Mother nature. Don't cry if your business gets flooded out, hit by a hurricane or decimated by a wild animal, it happens..... You've picked a fight with a giant that you can never control...... So take it on the chin or move on. The more I think about it, (and I have done lately due to various threads), the more I believe that otters could well be the saviour that true carp fishing needs. IMO, the industry has created a monster, too many anglers fishing for too many fish, 30lbers ten a penny, lakes with nothing under 20lb. An industry that feeds more Asians than Brits. The true ethos of angling, be that hunting or trapping, and the skills that come with it, being lost to people shooting fish in a barrel. The odd runs water, fine for youngsters to learn how to handle double figure fish..... Lakes with 80 plus carp per acre, no thanks. Nature would have nothing to do with that and reminds us every now and then by natural culling, via disease or predation, low oxygen etc.... Yes, otters were reintroduced, but not all of them. They've bred successfully and spread around the country because of the rich pickings that the businessman has put on a plate for them. Ask these questions, Do otters damage businesses?............... Can do. Does otter predation damage angling?...........Nope, not in my opinion. Not for the sort of angling I enjoy. There are still fish to be caught and in more natural numbers. If fewer fish leads to a decline in anglers on the bank then bring it on. It will be an acid test to see what people are really in it for.... The pleasure or the man made glory. I'd wager, that when the balance is achieved, with healthy numbers of otters and fish side by side, that there will still be 100 times more carp than there used to be. But whilst we are still stuffing more fish into our lakes,(again, all in the name of business) that balance will be hard to achieve. They say "Don't mix business with pleasure", I'd go further to say "Don't mix business with nature"

No worries Chill, I was in rant mode earlier.... Had a chilled out walk round a lake to clear my head.... All good.

The problem is the very venues some might think they will be left with, are the one's disapparing first ! BC wasn't having a pop either mate apologies if you thought I was .

Oh, its getting touchy, not argumentative, but we are touching on issues within angling as a whole, and opinions are split both ways. In 'natural' waters, nature finds a balance, between silver fish, tench, bream, pike, carp and perch. On the whole we have created carp only waters, and carp only anglers, in the process taking out other species. There are so many lakes that are carp only, from match fisheries where carp are used to build big winning weights, to 'specimen' carp only waters, big fish, loads of carp from say stocked at 10lb to biggest fish going 30lb+. Any fishery owner that creates or owns a fishery now is a complete norbert if they do not put a fence around it if it is at all possible. The cost of a fence is cheap compared to stock, however it goes missing, otters, other causes... However as has been mentioned, other nature can't go through a fence either, foxes, deer, badgers, which do not predate on fish, but use the water for drinking, or hunting insects, rats, or if a fish does die and get near the bank, scavenge it. I think B.C. and I are the same sort of area, I won't join CAPS, because there are so many carp anglers. A non carp angler may struggle to find a swim at the weekend. I do disagree slightly with B.C. though as grouse moors, which put money into a business are actually managed, and create more nature within the environment, however a fishery where money is king, other species are losing out. Anyone can create a fishery, dig a hole, get change of land use document, fill it with water, stick £10000 worth of carp in, and there is a day ticket lake that will make money. Otters are protected, over protected in my opinion, and partly because of that numbers are higher than they should be. Carp I do not think are as good as avoiding otter predation than other species. Carp mostly, do not shoal like roach or bream, which protect themselves in numbers. Add to that, a 20lb carp, likely higher nutritional value than a 1lb roach, less effort to catch the carp than the roach or bream. Yes all species are at risk, but carp more so.

What are you basing that argument on though BC? I can tell you now that one of the lakes I was fishing was lower stock than anything anyone else on here is or was fishing. Hasn't stopped the otter wiping it out . Bit like you can tell people who haven't fished at range .... you can also tell people who haven't had or seen the otters work close up .

Steve I do share your thoughts to some degree, nature will find an equilibrium, but at the cost of many a fish. You say, maybe fishing will return to the way it was, maybe it will, I'll certainly still be fishing but as Kev suggests, I want a chance of breaking my PB, or at least replicating it. Plus, I don't want to feel imprisoned inside a fenced fishery. Other animals depend on water and fences will stop this. I think the only way forward to to get Fishery Owners, Managers the right to deal with what ever threatens their livelihood. Many don't want to see the word CULL, but let' face it. Simply moving an Otter somewhere else doesn't solve the problem. Maybe the word CONTROL, would be a better phrase. I'm not being funny, a fence is only as secure as the anglers who fish, I've seen many an angler leave gates wide open. I've heard of fenced fisheries been wiped out by animal rights cutting holes in fences. The PAG are doing what they can but fighting any governing body takes years and it could well be to late. Carp fishing now feels like a battle against time, it's something I really don't like but that's just the way it is. Some of the waters in the Cotswolds will never be fenced because their nature reserves, these waters are some of the best around but for how long?

Another little teaser on the Wychwood FB page....

Back to not knowing what to think or make of it Leave it to the 'experts' and start reading more of the posts

That's good though isn't it, keeps numbers down since there are only so many Kms of watercourse

A male otter can have a range of 40Km (25 miles) watercourse, and they set up a few base camps along the way, the females have smaller ranges. Now I'm thinking this may be why they don't eat much and just move along, something quick and light to keep them going. Since they control such a large range, there shouldn't be too many otters in an area. Many of the young die, some from fighting with other otters when moving through their territory.

Keep forgetting about eagles, I did consider dogs but changed my mind after Nicks comment about the foxes being chased off. But it does make sense. Now here's an interesting read which incidently answers your question Danny. I must admit, since reading it I'm starting to form new opinions and coming up with new theories (this could get dangerous )

No doubt Danny .... watched a program on Tele a few years back can't remember what world river it was but these were giant otters & they were defending there young from crocs & winning on that occaion. Think the reintroduction was a good thing but there needs to be control too . Another point to mention these otters we have now are the European otter & a fair bit bigger than are native otter was .

I think it depends what you want out of your fishing and how much the ticket costs..... If they are getting caught, then why not have a go for them. If it's one particular fish you are targeting and you are not sure if it is still in there, that could mess with your head. If you are looking for a bite a chuck, probably not the best place to fish either..(but who want's that anyway?) Here's the thing, a place gets a reputation for being ottered, loads of anglers drop off, more bank space, still enough fish to go at. It's not all bad.... You'll get a better idea of what's left when they group up to spawn. If it's a big enough water, the otter may have found easier pickings elsewhere having thinned the numbers out on your lake. And just like the otter, the glory hunters will look for easier pickings too, imo, making the few anglers that fish it, easy to be around. A real buzz catching one too, as you don't know what's left. In some ways like fishing for the unknown... So, "yes" to your question. As long as price and expectations are set accordingly imo.

At the end of the day mate there are still going to be special fish in all the waters your concerned about for sure. I've seen pictures of incredible fish from canals, rivers and unknown waters that shows there's still hope. I guess you've got a really good chance to go out there and catch these fish whilst everyone else has gone onto new waters because of these concerns. I'm a bit doom and gloom just because I don't want waters all fencing it looks pretty ugly but it's necessary. My mate showed me canal carp that we fed like pets last year so of which I would love to catch so give it a go I say 😊 If I wasn't in a syndicate I would see this as poop or bust time go catch them sharpish before the numbers dwindle more.

Oh well. Couldn't wait in the end. Went with my original plan and ordered the 60" MHR on Tuesday from Total Fishing Tackle. With the discount code (ebay) I got it for £116.99 delivered, and I couldn't really say no at that price. It arrived yesterday. My next session is next Tuesday. Weather forecast suggests that I won't need to take it with me, we'll see nearer the time! I won't bother with the two vents in the back. For one, I don't think I'll need them with the material Wychwood use, and two, I don't want to jeopardise the 5 year warranty. I'll let you know what I think once I've got it up and running.