salokcinnodrog

The only thing stopping what you add to Vitalin is your Imagination. Pellets, whole and Powdered, Hemp, Pigeon Conditioner, other Particles, Tuna, other Groundbaits, Bread Crumb, Base Mix, Robin Red, Spices, Gravy Powder, Whole/Crushed/Crumbled Boilies I regularly add Particles to my Vitalin and the best way I have found is to prepare it the night before you use it, easy even on the Bank if you take a Large Bucket of ready Prepared Particles. The water of the Particles gets absorbed by the Vitalin, just play around until you get the right amount to do what you want with it. This mix is soft enough to go in a Spod, or stiff enough to be used as Groundbait and Balled in or Method Fished

Potassium sorbate is a mild preservative. Its primary use is as a food preservative (E number 202). Its molecular formula is C6H7O2K and its systematic name is potassium (E,E)-hexa-2,4-dienoate. Potassium sorbate is effective in a variety of applications including food, wine, and personal care. Potassium sorbate is the potassium salt of sorbic acid. Potassium sorbate is used to inhibit molds, microbes and yeast and to increase shelf life, and is used in such tiny quantities that there is no known adverse health effects. Like I said I don't like Potassium Sorbate in my food, its not got a good reaction with Yeasts Either, which I used to use in a lot of my Bait, also I like the 2day old sugar and enzyme forming on baits from the freezer. Potassium Sorbate prevents this from forming.

Standard Preservatives include Sugar, Salt, both can be added, but you won't really get much additional time out of them. (couple of days) The best Preservative for making Bait last longer is Nutrabaits Preservabait, but even then you won't increase the Life by much unless you AirDry them. The preservatives used in Shelf Lifes are things like Potassium Sorbate, which I don't trust, even in MY Food!

I switched to Combi Rigs for a Few sessions this year. Amnesia as the Boom section and either Merlin or Super-Nova as the Supple section of the Hooklink and to be honest they did not outfish my standard Braided Hooklinks at all. The only benefit I found was that the rig did not tangle, but since I had no Tangle problems with my Normal Braided Hooklinks it was not a Noticeable advantage. Saying that I did not get much fishing in down to Personal Problems, so it deserves a Real test next year

Fishing Long Braided Hooklinks can be a Nightmare, but I do have a way round the Problem and its fairly Simple. It needs to be for me to remember it and comes from Kryston in a Bottle Called Superstiff. I coat my hooklinks in the Stuff, then Fold them down into manageable lengths for Casting. The Superstiff dissolves in water and the Hooklink can then be taken and as a fish takes it concertina's open. The Long Hooklinks with a Running Lead and Slack Line often give amazing runs. A couple of Bleeps then a Run that just increases in speed.

Hi Matty, Welcome to the Forum Mate Thats what I have been saying through a lot of this Thread. I don't normally use complicated rigs, I use what works for me on the Water i'm fishing. I hardly ever use D-rigs, unless I believe that I can get a better presentation from it (which I think I do when using Snowman Baits). The majority of my Rigs are simple Braided hooklinks with a Line Aligner or Knotless Knot. Its my Rigs that are pictured on the Rig Tying Section and New To Carp Fishing Stickys, tied by my own Fair Hands. I have been using these rigs effectively for over 15years In my view the only things that need changing are normally the Rig length or the Hair length.

Slugs, thats not a Strange Bait, that one of my Stalking Specials Try Malteasers, Jelly Babies, Cola Bottles and goodness knows how many other sweets. Baked Beans, Sugar Puffs, all work. Think there was another thread not that long ago on strange baits, I'll try to find it!

lol Too slow, already been there Good Ingredient in a Particle/Spod Mix!

I think that the Heinz Beans are the only beans that are really Baked. The others are nearly all Soaked and Boiled in Tomato sauce. Do Mushy Peas make a good Groundbait ingredient when using Peas on the hook?

MMMMMmmmm!!!! Baked Beans are a great Bait as Coops Says, but my choice is for the Shops own brand rather than Heinz. The Heinz Beans I find are too well cooked and are a little bit soft, whereas the Own Brand are slightly tougher.

Sorry Just reading through this Thread again and double checked the validity of some of the posts, against my thoughts and noticed this. Not being funny but a Combi Rig is not a Simple Rig! It is an advanced presentation designed for use where Braid was needed for Subtlety yet unable to be fished as Total Braid is not Tangle free. Most hooks can be made more effective by lengthening the Shank of the Hook, either with a Stiff Presentation or by adding Tubing of some form. By Stiff Presentation You could stiffen up by other means, not just tubing. Yet ShortShanked wide Gape Hooks seem to be the Best Selling hooks of the moment, so why are we fishing with a presentation that is Naturally inefficient? Going back over my Last Post I just noticed I put that I prefer Short Shanked Hooks, but even these I lengthen with a Line Aligner/tubing.

Again Not necessarily. My choice of Hook Pattern is dictated mostly by whether I'm using a Pop-up or not. For Pop-ups I prefer to use Long Shank Hooks, yet for Bottom Baits I like short shank hooks like the Standard Carp-r-Us Nailers, Centurions, Owner FLB's and the Like. If I use a Pop-up I normally switch to the Longshank Nailers and also some Nash Outpoint Hooks I bought Years ago. Although I do fish Snowman presentations with Short Shanks Hooks. Any hook can have the Shank Length extended by the use of Tubing or Shrink Tube and its easy enough just to set it up with a Line Aligner.

Not necessarily. I try to use the opposite of what other Anglers are using. Most are using Fluoro's and Mono at the moment so I'm still using Braids and Coated Braids. I have found that Braid is more supple than Mono and Fluoro's and in my mind because of this harder to eject as it crumples rather than staying stiff. Yet as we progress from mono onto braid and forwards this suppleness can lead to missed runs. It is simply the fact that I'm fishing differently to the majority of other Anglers as to why I stick with Braids. With Braid it is a matter of seconds to change the hooklength and Hairlength. I've also found, probably down to practice, that I can tie Braided Hooklengths in seconds, a lot faster than I can tie a mono/Fluorocarbon link.

The amount of experiments I did on a Runs water last year between trips on my Big Fish water, strangely enough it was always the simple rigs that worked on the Runs Water. This is a water that is heavily fished by the Match Style Anglers. Simple rigs and baiting situations beat the "Complicated Rigs" hands down. I actually lost a couple of fish on the more "advanced" presentations where I had been playing around. Running Lead and Paternostered rigs definately produced the most strikable indications. I also found that on very short Stiff type presentations produced more lost fish than anything as well. My feelings are that the Carp were being hooked at the extreme edge of the Lip and as I was playing them the hook worked free. Yet to lengthen the rig and switch to braid produced more fish without loss.

Thats the thing. Most rigs were designed to do a specific job on a specific water. The Hutchinson Sliding Hair Rig, the Withy Pool Rig and The D-Rig are all examples. A simple hair rig WILL work on most waters, but once the Carp start getting wary the majority of the time the easy way to start catching again is to lengthen the Hair and/or Hooklength. The Withy Pool Rig if I remember rightly was designed for Fish that were not willing to take High Pop-ups that were needed to counter the Crayfish in Withy Pool, i.e the pop-up was being ejected too easily, so a long curved extension was added to make it difficult to eject. Who is to say that the Savay Rig would not have worked? Incidentally I believe it was Zenon Bojko who designed the Helicopter Rig, not for fishing in Silt, but for its Tangle free Long Distance Casting Properties. (Beekay's "Carp" by Rob Maylin). It was discovered that by having a top bead set further up the line that a good silt set-up could be created, and was published by Tim Paisley in Big Carp, over 10years ago.

Strangley enough the "simple" rigs that work well are the same rigs that I was fishing effectively with over 10years ago. My PB came on a double 18mm bottom bait on a long hair, line aligned braid hooklength of 20cms, those same rigs are still working for me today. The only thing that I have changed is the hook itself, as I found that with a Drennan Super Specialist the point got taken off too easily on gravel. When I caught my PB I actually lowered the End Tackle into the water so I could see that it had gone down safely. The hooks I use now are the Carp-R-Us Nailers, Centurions and Owners, these hooks on the same rigs have produced plenty of Big Fish for me up to 26lbs, and some of them from pressured waters; Yew Tree, Taverham Mills amongst others. The one thing that has changed is I have gone from a Semi-Fixed Lead to a Running Lead, for 2 reasons: 1) Everyone and his dog seems to fish a Semi-Fixed lead or Helicopter rig. 2) I feel I get better and more instant Indication with a Running Lead. Yet I know the best for Indication would be a Paternoster rig, but you actually have to be sat on the rods to hit a take, as many of my fish come at night I can't be awake for 24hours, although someone will say that I seem never to sleep:p I think until someone comes up with something new on this subject ,and there is a lot of it, I'm going over stuff that has been said before.

Alright Marcus I've seen Carp picking up stones as well. I think it was Rod Hutchinson who reckoned that if you coated a stone with a flavour impregnated icing and the Carp picked it up, on a short hair you "should " hook it. To go back to Adamxx's point about spooking off Line and Tubing, I think I have touched on this before, but not with a definite answer. To my mind Tubing, Line and Leadcore are normally fished tight and straight. How many things are the Carp's Environment are perfectly straight? If a Carp touches weed it moves and curves out of the way, yet if a Carp touches any of our End Tackle, including Line it pulls it taut against itself and possibly spooks. Now even in a weed free environment our Tight Lines can scare/spook or put Carp on guard against our End Tackle. It seems to me that many rigs are working on instant hooking, not Anti Eject, although the turning effect caused by the hook going into the Carp's mouth is presumed to be Anti Eject (its not). The other thing that again most people fish with is a short hair, more shank mounted baits than actually on a hair rig. As Jemsue says lengthen the Hair or Hooklength. Yet to cast that out is/can be a pain in the rectum. Rod Hutchinson's sliding hair is a very effective way of presenting a longer hair. This confuses Carp that take 1 suck to test the bait, which is drawn closer to the fish. The short haired baits then can't be taken on a 2nd suck as the hair is too short. The sliding hair baits are still able to be taken in on that 2nd suck. Yes it does happen, I have watched it. I think that I get happy with simple rigs and then I go and "complicate" the issue. Now regarding braids versus monos/fluorocarbons, another test that I tried was to feel the hooklength against my lips. With the braids they did not "feel" when touching my lips, it felt more natural. The monos and Fluorocarbons I could feel and to me they almost gave a shock on my lip. Yet most anglers at the moment are using Nylon Hooklengths, NOT Braids. The suppleness I think means that the hooklength is able to be taken in with less Resistance. I can see the point of Nylon in relation to Anti Eject, but again see my Point above. Steve in relation to your Spider Wire testing for Carp, I had the same idea a few years ago, but was worried due to the fact that the line is so thin that it may cause a "cheesewire" effect on the Carp's mouth while playing it. The thinnest Braid that I found that I was happy with was Kryston Supersilk. Drennan do produce a very thin braid, but I have the same reservations regarding it as I do the Spiderwire, even though the Diameter is much higher. I did have a testing medium that I used with a fixed weight that I pulled against while testing these braids, admittedly dry. The braids I tested were the Spiderwire, Drennan andone of Nash's braids. Unfortunately I have some rather nasty scars on my fingers where I managed to get a loop trapped round my finger while pulling it against the weight of my Workmate. The workmate fell over while testing and I couldn't let go in time. As Steve has bumped this thread up, quite fortuitously there are a couple more of my thoughts. Again I'm happy to be proved wrong, or if anyone has anymore ideas please add to the Complicated Scenarios that are currently ongoing!!! :D Nick

Marcus, I agree with you about the feel of the End Tackle, but I think there is something else in that as well, The Behaviour of the the Bait and Hook. I think it was Rod Hutchinson who first queried this in The Carp Strikes Back although I think it was in relation to fishing Sweetcorn at Redmire and how the Bait Behaved and how the Carp were coming onto the Baited Patch. If everyone is fishing 4-6inch rigs made with Fluorocarbon or Mono with the bait tight to the hook then the Bait is going to behave differently to that presented on an Inch Hair and a 18inch Braid Hooklength. The bait/hook on the 2nd rig is going to behave with more freedom and is more likely to find a spot to take hold than that on the "Usual" rig that the Majority are using. But to be sure that we are getting the best from our "Unusual Rig" we need the best Lead Fixing possible, so I would if possible fish a Paternoster, failing that a Running Lead and Slack Line.

I must add to the Tubing Debate. I think that what scares fish as has been mentioned is the tightness of the Line or tubing. I use Leadcore on 2 of my rods and Solar Tubing on 1. Strangely enough I have had 4 Carp from my Reservoir on Leadcore, compared to 1 on Tubing. Not very substantial odds I know, but of all the Bream I have caught as well I think only 2 have come on the Tubing Rod, compared to 50 odd on Leadcore. I have checked the tubing in the Margins, and it is the same colour as the weed and with a dash of Lead wire on the end it sinks flat to the bottom and can't be distinguished from the bottom. Leadcore also sinks straight to the bottom, but in the slightly siltier water at depth takes on the silt, so actually sinks into it. After retrieving it and going out to compare the 2 in the water neither could be seen against the bottom, but the tubing could be felt against the hand, yet not the Leadcore. In terms of rigs that give best indications for us Carp Anglers who have to sleep sometime, I think the Running Lead and Slack Line approach is by far the best option if possible. In Weed I know what the majority of Anglers say, that they need a Semi Fixed Lead, either on a Lead Clip or tied on, but I have had no problem with Running Leads. I have had no snagged fish, no lost leads and no problems playing fish through weed and also received instant indication at the buzzer. As Jemsue says though if the Fish are confident in your Bait, and the rig you are using is effective then you should not need the most complicated rig just beccause it is fashionable. Look at the damage the Bent Hook rig did to "Our" Fish. The rig was designed for particular feeding on a particular water, then got taken out of context and severely damaged many fish when it was used willy nilly. We have many things we can play around with on a standard rig, hair length, rig length, are just 2. With changing just those 2 things we could probably hook the majority of the Carp in the Waters we have today.

I freely admit that a lot of the time I do experiment with rigs to find out what works in any given situation, as Steve (ripslider) does. I know that with Paternoster that indication is far improved over most other types of Lead Fixings. I also know you have to be awake and aware sat next to your rods to use it. I'm currently working on a way to make extending hooklengths work on a particular lake that is Heavily Match Fished, where the Carp are very cute. Where the Method is treated with disdain and where heavy baiting is the kiss of death. Just to throw a spanner into the works again. The rig I have caught most of my fish on this season is.... Plain Basic Hair rigged and Freelined Mixer. lol:D Nick

Just for the Record when I fished last night and had 2 carp and 1 bream all of the fish were hooked on a Slack Line Running rig. The first Carp didn't run, I don't think that on a 9inch hooklength it actually knew it was hooked until I struck on 3 bleeps of the Delkims. Incidentally I have my Clutches set very tight, so I can try to pull the Carp off balance. This Carp was hooked on a 9inch hooklink, line aligned and the hair was only about 24mm long, with an 18mm boilie, allowing just 6mm of travel. The rig material was Super Mantis and the Running Lead was 3 oz The 2nd Carp was hooked on a fluorocarbon hooklink of 9inches with a hook line aligned and a D-rig. The swivel end had a loop on it and the bait was an18mm boilie and half a Squid and Octopus 14mm pop-up on the hair loop to sit it nicely on the weed Carpet.. Again taken on a slack line and 3 oz Running Lead. Now in theory both these rigs are complicated. Both were fished over a previous Baited Patch that I think was just the smell remaining in the bottom until I topped it up with a couple of PVA bags of boilies and Pellets.

Quote by Ripslider "It's like I said on the distant days of the top of page two. There are times when the heavy, short linked shock/bolt rig is a better way of fishing." Steve, while I agree with you on most of that I don't think that the Heavy Lead 'n' Short Link is a better way of Fishing. I agree with the Heavy part, but I think that Short Links with a Heavy lead result in a lot of Fish being lost, either due to Hookpulls in the fight or in the Fish being wary of the End Tackle. If the fish is lost in the fight on a short Hooklink, I think that the bounce with the Lead so close to the Carps mouth results in the hook being bounced out. I actually lost a Carp last night on a Short Link with a Heavy lead, the first time in ages I have dropped below 7inch hooklink. It is also the 1st Carp I have lost in about 3 years due to a hookpull. As for being awake having to strike with either a Fixed Paternoster or Running Lead again you are right. It is that having to strike with a proper Running Lead or Paternoster that put many Anglers off. I don't class as a Running Lead a lead that can run free but with a tight Line. By definition the lead is not able to run when the line is tight to the rod tip and reel. You are creating a Fixed Point in the Tackle. Please note I have corrected my Error in my Previous post, I missed out 2 important letter on my comment about Resistance

The original Hair Rig set-up consisted of a hooklink less than 0.6m (2ft) with a size 4 hook and a hair of 5-7.5cm (2-3in). It was designed to eliminate the sucking and blowing of baits , that occur even with free baits. What made the hair successful was that hard baits were used , the bait having to be taken to the back of the Carp's mouth to be crushed. There are 3 places that a hair can be attached to the hook and my theory of what happens. 1) From the eye, 2) Off the Bend, 3) Along the shank. A hair swinging from the eye of the hook will be fine when the hook and bait are blown out, but on sucking or picking up could actually hook outside the mouth or not entering at all. A hair attached to the bend of the hook will definitely be sucked in the right way, but when blown out the hook will be turned in the mouth, exiting bait and bend first, with little chance of the hookpoint catching. A hair attached to the shank of the hook I think ensures that the hook goes in the right way , bend first, and when ejected it will pivot round trying to force the hook out eye first, thus hooking in the Carps lip. Now in modern fishing the hair has become shorter to become the Ultimate Bolt/Anti Eject rig. The hair is normnally now around 1/2 to 1inch long. In addition the hooklength has now become shorter, now between 6-9inches long. The short hair, short link and tight line all contributing to the fish hooking itself when it tries to spit out the hook. However this short hooklink/short hair and tight line approach mean that the only indications of takes are those in which the Carp have hooked themselves. Sucking fish, I have watched and checked other research, suck from as much as 6inches away from the bait. Baits that are on a short hair will spring back as the hair reaches its full length. This suck is often powerful enough to register a twitch on the indicator. Now I agree with Steve that the best way of de-registering resistance is to minimise the lead attached directly to the line. (Work That one out). If you can change the hair length to something that the Carp are not expecting, maybe going back to the original concept of the hair in its confidence rig scenario with a paternoster, then you should have excellent indication, no resistance and extremely confused and more hooked Carp.

I thnk the problem with the short rigs is that Carp aren't actually getting the bait to the back of their throat to crush it down. We are trying to hook them the second they pick up the bait, whereas with the longer rigs we could be getting more strikeable indications by allowing the Carp to actually get the bait right back. If the Carp are testing baits by rolling them around then the short hooklink is going to give less movement and at the same time give us that twitch/bleep that means 'you've been done'. The longer hooklength gives the bait freedom to move and then the Carp can move off with the hook unable to use the Lead as a resistance point. If we take this a little further, if you hook a Carp at the edge of the lips and have hookpulls on occasional fish then the hooklink or hair is probably too short. If we can get the bait to the back of the Carps throat we are giving ourselves more time to get a strikeable indication.

I'm going to try this Long hooklength out on a couple of waters. On one there are some very cute Carp, that are extremely rig shy, in very clear water, although the biggest in the lake is only about 14lb. The other is reliant on baits but quite cloudy. I'll try with and without the Superstiff to see what the Carp can/can't get away with on both waters. On the longer hooklength I'm still convinced that we may get better runs as the Carp won't understand what is happening, being used to pull for resistance at say 6inches. Just thinking that if it is possible to pin down loops, then Silkworm and Merlin may be good hooklengths in longer lengths, even BFA Deception which is exceptionally thin. I think that the majority of Carp are hooked when they pick up the Bait, then move far enough to straighten the hooklink. Now if the Danger Radius is 6-9inches then in that 6-9inches the Carp will move with extra caution so they can stop and shake the hook out if they get pricked. Tim Paisley wrote in To Catch A Carp when he went back to hooklinks of 45cm (15inch) he caught more bigger Carp. Another point he mentioned is that more Carp are lost on shorter hooklinks. The point is that the Carp are only lightly hooked around the edge of the lips, because the Bait is not taken far enough into the fishes mouth, due to this the hook can work out more easily during the fight. Now this long hooklink theory starts to be borne that if the Carp are inspecting and playing with the hookbait then a long hooklength gives them more to play with and you have given them less chance of identifying the hookbait from the freebies. It also means that the bait can be taken further back into the Carp's mouth giving a better strikeable indication. God this is getting too much, all this thinking. lol:confused: :D