Lead core. Good idea or complete rip off??

[bini4a]

An arguement between myself and my brother has been going on for a bit now.

 

I've been using leadcore leaders, as it helps keep the line low in the water and not spook the fish. My brother refuses to use it because its expensive and says its pointless and is only sold to catch anglers wallets.

 

Trouble is, we both catch fish and theres not much noticable difference between us.

 

So does it make a difference or not?

[patos1]

I use ESP leadcore all the time. I think it does make a difference personally. The ESP stuff takes on silt from the bottom and quickly blends in nicely. Its also nice and thick and is less prone to lifting scales from fish.

Plus there is always the 'if it gives you confidence' bit to factor in then it can only be good.

I'd just like to point out that if leadcore isnt used correctly then the carp are at risk. Use it wisely and there are no problems IMO.

[carphunter99]

Cant agree more used the esp leadcore for ages and im convinced it makes a difference to my fishing. I also like the way it gives me a few angles to tryrig wise such as the chod rig or more standard helicopter rig where i can move my hooklink up and down the leader.

[goblin]

just dont use super bouyant pops for hook baits especially on a chod rig, tendancy to lift the leadcore giving the total opposite effect you were looking for

[evans]

If your brother is not using leadcore what is he using?

Rig tubing?

[davidford]

Leadcore is a good idea for 3 main reasons firstly it pins the line down behind your rig therefore giving the carp nothing to spoke on secondly it stops tangles as it is stiffer than mainline and therefore will act like a boom and push away from the rig as it hits the water and thirdly it is carp safe as it doesnt get under their scales and flick them off

 

There are other reasons such as it abrasion resistant properties and it being easier to use than rig tubing.

 

If you have a carp on and it goes for a snag your mainline will break straight away but the leadcore is strong enough to hold firm hope this helps

[marker]

i agree with your brother mate, sold to catch anglers just about sums it up nicely

[davidford]

i agree with your brother mate, sold to catch anglers just about sums it up nicely

 

Totally wrong sold for carp welfare and as shown in korda dvds pins line down to avoid carp spooking on your line

 

Really annoys me when i catch a carp missing scales because of people not using leaders

[kevtaylor]

i agree with your brother mate, sold to catch anglers just about sums it up nicely

 

So what do you use instead?

 

As has been said before leadcore takes on silt and blends in very well with the lakebed, other leaders are more visible and probably cost more and tubing sucks IMO

[sharpy86]

Never used leadcore, and wouldn't know where to start to make it safe to use. i.e. in event of a snap.

[bini4a]

If your brother is not using leadcore what is he using?

Rig tubing?

 

To be honest. He likes things very simple. He has no leader, just the main line with a free running 2.5oz lead. Swivel and his hook link.

 

I agree davidford, soft leaders like ESP, protect the fish a bit more. But then again, i think most damage done is not from a mono mainline but from people not bothering to wet thier hands before touching them, or not wetting a mat, or not even using one! i have seen anglers with a fish on the gravel bank with their mat behind them

[marker]

your post really does frighten me david you really need to look a bit deeper into leadcore mate, the stuff just isn't safe for carp fishing

its been banned on a lot of waters because people just can't tie it up safely.

take a long hard look at your last statement in your first post, your mainline breaks but leadcore is much stronger etc etc.

think about it, if your mainline breaks and you haven't set it up correctly that carp gets left towing the leadcore, if your rig is really poorly constructed it ends up towing the leadcore and your lead too

how does the carp get free if the leadcore/lead snags up? the simple answer is it doesn't, it dies a slow and lingering death through starvation

the only safe way to set up leadcore is to use a cv safety/helicopter rig, in the event of the mainline breaking the hooklength can slide off the leadcore and everything gets dumped, any other way of using leadcore is dangerous, safety clips and inline leads used with leadcore are potential death traps if i had my way it would be banned from every fishery in the country

use tubing mate, the esp tubing is heavier than leadcore anyway so it pins the line better, you won't get any lifted scales with tubing and in the event of you mainline breaking you haven't got a fish towing round something it can't escape from if it gets stuck

bini and his brother can't tell the difference in results so that should tell you its pretty pointless using it, its expensive, uneccesary and potentially dangerous so why take a risk using it

[bini4a]

I think you have a good point here Marker

 

I use both bolt rigs (with safty clips) and helicopter rigs with leadcore and it has occured to me that it wont break off in a snap.

 

I think the expense of it as well, especially if you buy pre made ones like ESP, outways the slight benifits, especially as i normally lose one in a tree or a island every blemmin' time i go fishing

 

Still might continue to use one on one rod and simpler on another (ie tubing or as my bro) Needs more reserch i think

[davidford]

if your on an easy runs water with a lot of smaller carp then the difference will not be as noticeable but on harder lakes the advantages leadcore offers is very noticeable. I agree leadcore should only be used for helicopter rigs and also running rigs which i use it for when slack lining you can use inlines with gardner plummet as this is very thin and i have noticed that the lead can pass over the splice no problem without tail rubber or with widened hole. As for leadcore being banned it is on a minority of waters and with the amount of pre-tied leadcore leaders becoming available there is no excuse for using a poorly spliced leader. Also the banning of leadcore is only a fishery managers opinion and is not the gospel truth many fisheries ban barbed hooks yet recently it has been said that barbless hooks do more damage as they can move easier than a barbed one that holds firm. I think it is cemex who ban barbless hooks. Also you originally said you do not use leaders as they are to catch anglers and my point was about was carp safety and in your next post you said you use rig tubing which is fair enough i thought you used mainline straight through

[marker]

as a general rule bini, don't tie the leadcore to your hooklink swivel if you do this, the fish tows the leadcore along with the hooklength and this just isn't acceptable in this day and age even if the lead gets lost

it has to be a helicopter style setup to be safe, furthermore, if you splice leadcore don't splice it into a loop, splice it to your mainline with a needle knot, doing it this way enables any beads and your hooklink swivel to come away easier in the event of your mainline breaking

to be honest, its far easier and safer not to use it

[bini4a]

I think that companies should take a little more interest in what could happen in a break with the stuff they sell.

 

Towing leadcore may be bad enough, but what about those KORG or KORUM feeders with the elastic in the middle. They are basically a fixed setup with no possibilty of anything breaking free.

 

And if you think about it, depending on where your line can break, leadcore or no leadcore, the possibilty of having 40ft of briad dangling out of the fish will still snag around weed, braches, lillys etc...

[sharpy86]

And if you think about it, depending on where your line can break, leadcore or no leadcore, the possibilty of having 40ft of briad dangling out of the fish will still snag around weed, braches, lillys etc...

Very true... Even mono isn't really safe if it breaks a fair way from the swivel. In all fairness, a helicopter style rig is the safest. As the fish is left with only the hooklink.

[kevtaylor]

if i had my way it would be banned from every fishery in the country

 

Along with clear and coloured leaders and shock leaders which are no different. Should it all be banned? I think not!

 

I notice your not saying use lighter hooklinks and barbless hooks because that would add no weight to your arguement and be far too simple.

 

This attitude where people get on their soap box to attack things that are in fact fine if used correctly gets right on my ........!

 

Your point is in part valid, however I would prefer education instead of stances to ban products due to the actions of an uninformed minority.

 

Leadcore and any other leader material is perfectly safe in the right hands - so why ban the product??

[marker]

yes mate i'd send clear, coloured and shock leaders the same way

its debatable wether education works, with some people yes, with others no, i'm of the opinion we should be protecting all of our fish now, not continually having to educate people who come into the sport

education is a nice idea but how many fish will continually have to pay the price? people come and go from carp fishing all the time so rather than educate its easier and safer to just ban them

[carpingod150]

I have seen fish trailing leadcore etc. but it's just the idiots who don't know how to use it. You shouldn't use it unless you are 100% sure of how to use it safely and properly. It can be made unsafe, in the same way rig tubing can, by the idiots that put a swivel behind the tubing, but IMO, companies should show better how to use the stuff!

 

The new Solar stuff is good, comes with instructions etc, but I use the ESP leadcore, and it's brilliant stuff!

 

I feel more fish will be damaged by mainline lifting scales from people that don't use tubing or leadcore, and in my experience, the people harping on about fishcare at the rig end are the ones that are worst when they get the fish on the bank! I once talked to a bloke for half an hour, about the importance of breakaway leads and rig components, only to see him, 5 minutes later, put a 12lb carp on a wooden platform to unhook it, and then throw it back, from the comfort of his chair!

 

If you have a carp on and it goes for a snag your mainline will break straight away but the leadcore is strong enough to hold firm hope this helps

 

The mainline will break anyway, as it's weaker than the leadcore, but it will still have the same pressure exerted upon it if a fish does go for the snags!

 

Another thing about lead clips, what happens if you crack off, and a fish takes the bait, hooking itself in the process, it'll end up trailing your hooklink, lead, leader/tubing, and X amount of line!

 

This is why, 90% of the time, I use running leads, or helicopter rigs with a weak link of 3lb nylon tied to the lead.

 

However, if I do use lead clips, I use the ESP ones, which I've had 4-5lb carp on, and when they shake their head, it discharges the lead! Which, I think is great, because, as I said before, if you crack off, it'll leave an effective rig on the lakebed, whereas with the ESP clips, the fish can just shake their head to lose the lead

 

I'd rather lose a 50p lead than kill a fish, any day of the week.

[hopefull]

I use leadcore, mainly the Kryston Score stuff, in about 3' to 4' lengths that i splice myself. I've found it to be pukka so far - very heavy yet nice n supple too. I use running rigs 99% of the time, with just a buffer-bead pushed over the swivel spliced to the leadcore, and an inline lead running free on the leadcore. I then tie the leader onto the mainline with a palomar knot through a small spliced loop. This way, if i do snap off, the lead is guaranteed to slide free, and as my hooklink is 50% or so less of the breaking strain of my leadcore, it'll snap first anyway if a fish does get snagged.

[evans]

your post really does frighten me david you really need to look a bit deeper into leadcore mate, the stuff just isn't safe for carp fishing

its been banned on a lot of waters because people just can't tie it up safely.

take a long hard look at your last statement in your first post, your mainline breaks but leadcore is much stronger etc etc.

think about it, if your mainline breaks and you haven't set it up correctly that carp gets left towing the leadcore, if your rig is really poorly constructed it ends up towing the leadcore and your lead too

how does the carp get free if the leadcore/lead snags up? the simple answer is it doesn't, it dies a slow and lingering death through starvation

the only safe way to set up leadcore is to use a cv safety/helicopter rig, in the event of the mainline breaking the hooklength can slide off the leadcore and everything gets dumped, any other way of using leadcore is dangerous, safety clips and inline leads used with leadcore are potential death traps if i had my way it would be banned from every fishery in the country

use tubing mate, the esp tubing is heavier than leadcore anyway so it pins the line better, you won't get any lifted scales with tubing and in the event of you mainline breaking you haven't got a fish towing round something it can't escape from if it gets stuck

bini and his brother can't tell the difference in results so that should tell you its pretty pointless using it, its expensive, uneccesary and potentially dangerous so why take a risk using it

 

Leadcore is no more expensive than rig tubing!

ESP leadcore £12.95 for for 25 meters and ESP rig tube/ancher rig £1.80 for two meters.

Leadcore 52p per meter

Rig tube 90p per meter

 

Rig tubing is more expensive leadcore all the way

 

[courtz]

I'll only really use leadcore on helicopter rigs, as i find that using tubing the swivel will shear through the tubin and damage the mainline.

 

ESP anchore tubing in 1.25mm along with as flying backlead helps to pin the rig down just as much in my opinion, and i prefer touse this foor safety clips.

 

As with a few things in the right hands they are fine, but in the wrong hands they can be deadly

[kevtaylor]

yes mate i'd send clear, coloured and shock leaders the same way

its debatable wether education works, with some people yes, with others no, i'm of the opinion we should be protecting all of our fish now, not continually having to educate people who come into the sport

education is a nice idea but how many fish will continually have to pay the price? people come and go from carp fishing all the time so rather than educate its easier and safer to just ban them

 

Banning a whole range of products that are not only effective but also lead to more fish being safely landed and not damaged in the process is crazy to say the least.

 

Your also exagerating the amount of fish that pay the ultimate price for unsafe set-ups on 2 counts - far less people fish unsafely than you imagine due to the amount of good literature around today and fish are a lot more able to shed hooks and subsequently rigs than you give them credit for.

 

Your helicopter/tubing setup that you rave to be completely safe is far from it as with all set-ups - nothing is foolproof and can snag through weedclod and tangles and many other scenarios, depending where the line breaks and how it has been set-up.

 

Your helicopter/tubing set-up is very poor in weedy lakes as the lead is unable to discharge.........! But do you make allowances for that - I'll guess not!

 

Going back to my point above barbless hooks and lighter hooklinks will improve the safety of any set-up.

 

Banning products is not the way to go - beginners to the sport and experienced alike now have access to information like never before so there are a hell of a lot of good anglers out there (young and old) who not only put fish safety first on the bank, but also in the thinking behind their set-ups.

 

If you have reason to suspect that someone is using what YOU deem to be a death-rig, speak to them or inform the baillif who can show them better ways.

 

Your thoughts seem very shortsighted and misleading - you could always look at the brilliant improvements in fishing practice, but I guess your glass is half empty?

[bini4a]

Kev's right here, theres that much out there to buy now in the market, its a dam sight better than 15-20 years ago, when we were all lads.

 

All fisheries have different rules on what you can use, some require you to use Barb hooks, one place told me that with Barbless the hook can come out and go back in numerous times, causing perforations in the lips and mouth, which is worse than the hole a barbed hook can make. weather its true or not i dont know.

 

Fisherie owners reserve there own right on what tackle to ban if any, this should be their responsibility, as its their fish, not the responsibilty of manufactorers