moorsey

I totally agree and it seems that 2 oz is almost the critical weight to stay below. I have even tried a 2 oz lead boated out to 200 yards plus and the hook hold was superb.

I won't bore you with massive amounts of details but the lake is 15 acres with a max of 10 anglers each week. Our stock is 286 carp and 49 catfish with the carp including (based on last years captures) 27 over 40.00 lb and at least 130 thirties. The cats range from upper doubles to 110.00 lb plus. If you would like any more info have a look at "www.moorlandfisheries.co.uk" and send me an email via the contact page and I will phone you to answer any other questions that you may have. Wherever you do decide to go have a good trip and be lucky. Keith

Thanks for that Daryl. I think any fishery owner worth his sort should make every effort to make sure that his customers are on fish and fishing in the most effective way. We get nothing back from anglers blanking and the more that catch personal bests the better our bookings look. I'm pleased to say that we hjave just completed our opening week with two lads and their girlfriends who were prepared to listen (well for most of the week anyway) to our advice and it payed off for them. They ended with 1 double, 12 twenties, 13 thirties and 4 forties of 41.00 lb, 41.00 lb, 46.04 lb and 46.08 lb. plus catfish of 20, 25, 42 & 45. And to cap it off have booked again. That's how we would like every week to go. Keith

Can't resist this. Come to Moorland Fisheries and I'll sort it all out for you. Keith

NEVER use braided main line without some kind of fish protection. This is the only time that I would always use a section of leader. The only time that I use braided main line is on the river but I then use 55 lb main line with a 110 lb braid casting leader and about 4 feet of 30 lb fluoro as fish protection and then an 18 lb fluoro hook link. That way any breakages should leave the fish with just the hook link to deal with. Keith

Yes mate. My lake is a clay bottomed estate lake so that is the rig that I use virtually all the time. The only thing that I sometimes change if I'm fishing into the real soft areas is to extend the link between run ring and lead with about 6-12" of lead core (see I do use it). By splicing it to the lead and then a swivel or loop on the other end you can still hook it onto the run ring and its length will keep the ring above the silt/weed. My own choices of fluoro are 1. main line = Big-carp fluoro 2. hook links = ESP soft ghost When I am using fluoro tied to a "D" I always use ESP "Stiff Riggers" because the eye is designed for mono type hook links and sets the hook at just the right angle. With a combi rig I use ESP curved shanx with a supple hair. As Nick said they are just my own personal choices based on experience and confidence. Hope that helps. Keith

Hi Sam, I use running rigs with light leads all the time now and I have messed around with all sorts of beads etc and the best that I can find at the moment are the ESP "helicopter buffer bead." They are a longish bead which fits right over the swivel and i then use a quick link for attaching my hook link with a long tapered boom which covers the quick link and fits inside the opening of the buffer bead. All knots and swivel etc are then covered and keeps it nicely tangle resistant. Hope that helps mate. Keith Hey keith, i have been using running rigs since i started fishing in august. i couldnt use straight through mainline because i was getting tangles on every cast. as soon as i switched to tubing tangles were a thing of the past. how do you do it? lol I'm guessing that you are using braided hook links or combi links with quite a long section of braid. To use them and reduce tangles you are right to use tubing or to feather the cast in order to straighten out the hook link just before it hits the water. Personally I prefer fluoro hook links tied to a "D" or combi rigs with the braided part shorter than the shank of the hook and I still feather the cast to keep it all straight. You will find that the "lob" type cast or even the underarm swing are the worst for tangles mate. One other tip is to use a small stick bag to pull the hook link through which will reduce tangles. If you don't want to add a food to the stick you could use glugged sand which will add to the flavour but not the food. Hope that helps. Keith

I agree Frank, I think I will still continue to use my bolt rig set ups but I will definitely try running rigs from now on! And you know what its like, if the running rig starts to produce fish, then all 3 rods will soon be on them! Haha There's one massive difference with running rigs over bolt rigs. You know when the fish has picked up the bait and don't have to wait for it to move the lead. On top of that the lead does very little to hook the fish. Another myth.

If you cut the swivel off of the lead they are even less prone to tangling.

You might even be able to afford hooks now then. lol.

Hi Sharpy and Fumanchu. I have been fishing running rigs with no tubing or leaders now for quite a few years and they are quite simply superb. Use light (under 2 oz) leads and the hook holds are superb because the lead begins to move fairly early on and as it trundles across the lake bed it "vibrates" the hook home. My entire set up is as follows 1. ESP stiff rigger on "D" rig or curve on combi rig ( but the braid part of the combi must be shorter than the hook shank length) 2. Soft Ghost hook link with figure eight loop. 3. Quick link to take hook link and boom slid onto hook link. 4. swivel to hold quick link. 5. ESP helicopter bead to protect main line knot. 6. Enterprise snag safe running ring with lead weight attached. 7. Main line to rod/reel. As an addition if you are fishing over weed or soft silt you can extend the distance between the run ring and the lead by using about 12" of lead core spliced to the lead and with a loop to attach to the snag safe. This will keep your run ring above the weed or silt and allow you to still use 7" hook links for better bite indication. It all works well for me and I set up one of our anglers with that set up last weekend and he has since landed several carp including two at 46.00 lb plus so the rig works for all sizes of fish. Keith

I have done no end of tests and there is nothing to beat simple heavy mono fished slack line style. None of the tubings or "heavy" leaders follow any but the smoothest of lake beds because they simply aren't heavy enough and are too stiff. My question would have to be "why go to the trouble to find the best, least visible main line that you can buy and then thread it through a length of "hose-pipe" where it will be closest to where you want the fish to be. Exactly the same can be asked of any of the leaders. They are 3 or 4 times the diametre of your main line so will be much easier for the carp to spot. My honest advice is to stick to simple running rigs with light leads and no tubing no leaders and no back leads of any kind. Just fish with the line slack and let everyone else pay silly prices for items of tackle that they don't need. Since I switched to the simple rigs my catch rate has quadrupled. Hope that helps mate. Keith

No they're not mate but can be adapted with some pva for the chuck.

Fenboy....this is exactly what I use. It looks very neat and tidy, I'm just worrying myself recently, that the swivel isn't big enough, and it provides more resistance than I would like? What do you think? Sharpy, get yourself a pack of the enterprise rigs that Jez posted about. They are superb and add that extra bit of fish safety to your rig. Keith

Jez, they are extremely effective and give another safety edge to even the running rig mate. Keith

OK mate. Now that I have a bit more understanding of your needs I will write a specific article for you with the basics (and pictures) of what is meant by a death rig as opposed to a safe rig. I will try to cover as many of the rigs that I have discovered rather than simply saying "don't do this." Incidently I am very proud to have been asked to write this and I sincerely hope that it helps for you mate.

Hi Sam, I use running rigs with light leads all the time now and I have messed around with all sorts of beads etc and the best that I can find at the moment are the ESP "helicopter buffer bead." They are a longish bead which fits right over the swivel and i then use a quick link for attaching my hook link with a long tapered boom which covers the quick link and fits inside the opening of the buffer bead. All knots and swivel etc are then covered and keeps it nicely tangle resistant. Hope that helps mate. Keith

Hi Pali My article for Advanced is written and posted mate. I will re-write it for you and add my thoughts on hooks and lead clips so that you have a complete argument to put forward. It would be good to be infront of cameras again but I think the language may be a minor problem mate. lol. Keith Edit; Pali, I have just glanced through some of the contents of your magazine on your link and was hoorified to see them showing a "helicopter" set up with a swivel at both ends. That is an absolute guaranteed DEATH RIG mate. There is no way that the fish can ever lose the lead weight and it WILL be tethered. Please make some comment to the editor to get that changed as fast as you can.

Just to keep everyone fully up to date I have just had a phone call from Chris Logsden from MKF and he tells me that they have lost another two thirties over the last 12 months from tethered leaders. It really is time that we, as anglers, began to put the welfare of the carp in front of the "catching at all costs" mentality that some have slipped into.

I genuinely think the thicker the line the less likelihood there is of this happening and the fact a lot of anglers fish with heavy line nowadays helps. Keith I will be honest and say I never really gave that a thought but I doubt it. If it were the hooklink it would surely effect the smaller carp, as there would be more likelihood of a long hooklink reaching their sides. You have caught enough big carp to realize that a short/standard hooklink will not reach the flank. My theory is that the scales are larger on the bigger fish and there is more likelihood of the line slipping under them. You will no doubt recall that I stated I use leaders in the margins for free lining, since doing this I have not had a problem. This could be coincidence though because as I said it was not a common occurrence. However you will be pleased to know due to our discussions on leaders I have re-thought my rigs for this season, and I will no longer use leaders for this. I will try heavy fluro mainline instead. Frank Be lucky mate, it certainly works for me. I'm currently using the "Big-carp" fluoro in 16 lb BS and I am very impressed (and I have to pay for it) so if you want the contact details let me know. Keith

In which case Frank, it could easily be the hook link that has lifted the scales and not the main line. If you think of the angles of the line with a fish taking off hard from under your feet the lead is likely to have been above it but with the hook link against its flank.

Ask away Andy it's the only way that we all learn. I have used mono/fluoro straight through on light running rigs for about ten years and honestly can't ever remember seeing scales lifted by it.

More than good enough mate. Whichever lake you decide to fish simply work out whether you really need a leader and if you decide that you don't need one don't use one. They are far from essential in most situations. Keith

I'm surprised that you find that figure ott. I would have thought that a good sized house, several acres of land withtwo large lakes included and a good business that turns over somewhere around 80,000. per annum is going to command that kind of figure as a whole.

I think that you will also see a report in Carp-talk and on the forums on Wednesday showing a fish that was wound in attached to a leader which was not lead core. The fish was tethered and DEAD.