willi4692

Much like Nick said, pop-ups are best used away from tight beds of bait. I think you should think about how you're fishing before using pop-ups just for the sake of it. If you're fishing a tight bed of particles I would suggest sticking to your bottom baits. I use a pop-up if I am fishing a spread of bait, usually on a choddy. Relating to the original question, it may be worth looking at Gaz Fareham's version of the 360 rig, I have been using this for 12 months or so and can't recommend it enough. The key thing with this rig is to keep the combi section as short as possible, you don't want the bait fully popped-up, you want the bait to act like a wafter.

ESP Stiff Rig in 20lb or Korda IQ

I feel a go anywhere rig largely relies on the lead system you decide to use. I feel the most go anywhere rig you could use would be on a helicopter set where the lead drops off. Tying the lead to a large ring at the end of your leader or mainline with 4lb mono should be enough to cast short to medium ranges and is safe in any condition. A rig as simple as a knotless knot hair rig would be presented well on a helicopter rig that has the back bead sitting a fair distance back.

My problem with this rig is that the tubing would make it very stiff. On a lake bed with lots of debris I would rather a supple hooklink to take on the contours of the lake bed. A stiff hooklink could sit up at funny angles and render the rig virtually useless.

Simply a long hooklink. When combined with a buoyant bait such as, pop-ups, cork balls, foam etc, will pull towards the surface and will present your bait off the bottom of the lake bed. For example, you see fish cruising on the surface, five feet up for instance, you create a hooklink five feet long with a buoyant bait and your bait should be presented on the surface, if you want a bait in mid water, 3 foot hooklength. If that makes sense, that is the basic principle of a zig rig. There are several things you can do to make the set up look far less blatant but that sort of information is all over this forum, have a quick look and i'm certain you will find all the information you need.

Is anyone else just waiting for Nick to lock this thread due to another leadcore debate?

I don't use the choddy at all, but, last year in advanced carp fishing magazine Jim Shelley publicised his flying chod rig. It's a rig I see as a very dangerous one and would never touch, BUT, my point is he claimed that it didn't matter what bottom was there, he just had to find the fish and cast his flying choddy at them. He knew that his rig would be around 10ft away from the lead and that his slow sinking choddy would presented perfectly over any bottom, hence why he doesn't use any other rig. All he has to worry about 'is finding the carp and casting to them', his words not mine.

I get the feeling this will be a very unpopular thread

Wrong choddys are for weed. Jim Shelley uses a choddy over any bottom apart from hard bottoms. The lead will sink into the weed and the rest of the leader or mainline will settle on top as long as the pop-up only just sinks under the wait of the leader or putty etc. A well tied and balanced choddy will settle on the tiniest strands of weed or bottom debris! Chods aren't for weed, honest indian The proper name for the set-up was Silt Rigs, that is where they were first designed for. They've become a standard approach, but in weed they can actually cause a few problems; hookpulls or line breakages where the ring abrades the line, or even when the line is being pulled at 90degrees to the fish. I believe Adam Penning has a few comments on it in this months Carpology Rotary Letter, Tim Paisley in one of his books, and also the great Danny Fairbrass said as much in The Korda Guide to Rig Making A semi fixed or running paternostered bait is better in weed, a long tail on a run ring attaching the bomb with a weak link Well lets say the modern angler seems to revert to the choddy for any bottom other than gravel. It may not be its original intention, but it seems to have become this way.

Very fair point Beanz, these are the exact reasons I never use Helicopter rigs! I would agree that a rig with the lead discharged is safer than a rig with the lead trapped on the line, but, I believe a 10ft piece of floppy leadcore is just as dangerous. As with all these things it is open to debate but I'm almost certain I will never feel a need to use a helicopter rig. Furthermore, never really feel the need to use a leader or tubing of any kind!

Wrong choddys are for weed. Jim Shelley uses a choddy over any bottom apart from hard bottoms. The lead will sink into the weed and the rest of the leader or mainline will settle on top as long as the pop-up only just sinks under the wait of the leader or putty etc. A well tied and balanced choddy will settle on the tiniest strands of weed or bottom debris!

Stiff rigs can be used in a number of ways. You can use a stiff presentation where by, you use a stiff material all the way through, hair included. Where the hooklink connects to the swivel you make a loop, like you would with the hinged stiff rig. This gives the rig flexability. There you have it a very simple bottom bait stiff rig. Also, may I add that the hinged stiff rig and the chod are designed to be fished off bottom debris, such as, weed, silt etc. It is NOT designed, and far less effective, when used on hard gravel. It is vitally important that a rig is used in the right situations. I feel pop-ups are too blatant on a hard gravel bottom and will always stick to a bottom bait in these situations. Remember a rig won't give you more pick ups, it will turn more pick ups into bites! A rig in the wrong situation though will work way against you!

He isn't, absolute rubbish! Any carp can pick up any size of hook, within reason, your not using giant catfish hooks and fishing for 2lb carp. It really doesn't matter what size you use as long as it is suitable. A carp of 12lb could pick up a size 2 but, do you need a size 2? Just to add, the biggest hook I use in the UK is size 6. Cheers Will

Still don't understand, there is no ring on this rig. It is just a simple knotless knot slightly modified, because the hook point hangs heavy it, in theory, should never hook a fish in the chin so to speak. As the fish suck the rig in, the bait flys into its mouth and the hook will be hanging ready to catch. A hook will never flip upwards on a take as it is against the laws of physics. So the chances of hooking a fish in the chin through bad rig mechanics is virtually impossible. I wouldn't worry about it (what ever your theory is )

I don't understand what you mean? It's designed to hook more effectively than other rigs, but all rigs are supposed to catch the bottom lip. No rig should be hooking the outside of the mouth and going in the inside, I don't know a rig that would be able to do this.

Would only use hinged stiff rig on a hard bottom because of the stiff materials. I would also only use the chod rig on choddy bottoms. If you like i could tie up and post some pictures of my favourite pop-up presentation? Its suitable for all bottoms and is now the only rig I use for my pop-up fishing, in fact you could use it for 100% of your fishing. My problem with pop-ups is that on a standard knotless knot rig if a fish pick it up from behind the hook, the hook will go in backwards and possibly not be as effective in the hooking.

Also just to add best used with a braid or coated braid with the end stripped back.

Very easy to tie, simple knotless knot but whip round the hair twice, pull the hair back and whip underneath a further five times. Supposed to be used with a hook with a curved shank. The hook will sit very aggresively. The important part of the KD is to use it with a buoyant bait, either pop-up or plastic baits, counter balance the pop-up with split shot just underneath the bait so it still sits on the deck. The effectively weightless bait makes the eye of the hook light, which in turn, makes the point heavy, therefore the point will hang low ready to catch the bottom lip in the case of a pick up. All this said I have used it, and caught fish on it, BUT I feel there are far better pop-up presentations out there. I used it when it first came into the media and didn't find it to up my catch rates or provide better hook holds so I havn't used it since. Hope this helps Will

Interesting....................so are you saying a Carp can tell the difference in weight from a freebie and a hookbait, how much does a standard sized hook weigh? Also if that is the point of using the cork, you would only need a tiny bit to equal the weight of the hook, I always thought the use of cork was to produce a neutral buoyancy hookbait or a pop up? Well thats the theory, you put the cork three quaters through to critically balance it. The cork at the back will pull the eye of the hook up making it effectively weightless, which in turn, make the point heavy and hang down to catch the bottom lip. But as i said it's all theory, not fact.

Korda way or not, the cork is to make the bait the same weight as the other freebies as the hook adds weight. As Beanz said you can do it either way it doesn't matter.

Kryston hooklink materials are some of the best on the market. Recently I have been using Suffix Camfusion as I fancied a change and have been impressed so far.

Really???? what materials do you use fella??? I cant stand the half blood myself in all honesty, plaomar isnt bad. Never had a half blood go using braid, monos it goes occasionally. I use the palomar with any material just an all round easy to tie and very reliable knot.

Palomar or the half blood get my vote

HA! All depends on the bait your using in how to set up the rig. Too broad a question I am afraid

At first I thought this was going to be a nice tale