cocobeware Posted March 18, 2008 Report Share Posted March 18, 2008 Been wanting to use running rigs for a while now but i just cant come up with a set up that im happy with. It seems like the only way to get a reliable set up would be to have a big lump of lead 4-5 0z so that the lead does'nt move and the fish can take line off the bait runner although possibly lighter when fishing in silt, however i think this sort of weight coupled with a pva bag would be way too heavy for my rods to get any distance. I understand what people are saying about using slack lines when fishing running leads but i dont get any indication on my buzzers as there has to be some sort of tension in the line for it to move the roller, although i suspect alarms such as delkims may give some sort of indication even with a slack line because they sense vibration. I would have to sit right by my rods and watch the line which is ok during the day but would obviously be no good for night fishing and even then it would only be free running until the fish has taken up all the slack line and starts to take line from the bait runner. I have come to the conclusion that the best set up might be to use drop off style indicators and alarms as in pike fishing so the fish could pull the line out of the clip and take line from the open bail arm and not feel any resistance at all allowing me to use a much lighter lead. I was wondering if anyone else had considered doing this as i feel its the only way to achieve a true free running rig. Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stoogi Posted March 18, 2008 Report Share Posted March 18, 2008 One or two thoughts on here. Should go some way to answering some of your questions https://forum.carp.com/carp-forum/viewtopic.php?t=26640 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salokcinnodrog Posted March 18, 2008 Report Share Posted March 18, 2008 Oh Oh! Have a read of this: https://forum.carp.com/carp-forum/viewtopic.php?t=26640 I'm certain I say it in there. With a Slack line, and a Running Lead, when you get a take, the line pulls tight, the fish is running, it does not stop when the line pulls tight to the Rod/reel. Why should the Carp take line off the Bait runner? you should have struck the run before then, even if you haven't the set-up still works well It is the slack line and heavy lead that creates the running situation. You don't need to go up to 4or5 oz, I use 3oz (Flat or Bottle Leads). A lighter lead than that in most cases is unlikely to stay still on the take. You don't need to have tension to move the roller, because the tension comes when a fish starts to run. You do not need to have any indicator on the line at all. I use Running Leads for Night Fishing, and don't have to sit by my rods. Yes I use Delkims, but my Mate uses either Giant alarms or Ron Thompson's (can't remember which) which have a wheel, and does the same as me. You hit the run before it takes line from the reel (or should), even if you don't the fish is still likely to be on the line. The Lead is free-running up the line, so there should be no possibility of the Carp using the weight of the lead to eject the hook. If you are worried about not having a True Running set-up then use a shocker set-up, again, indicator straight down, no tension on the line, then you get a run, the fish moves the set distance then the Run Ring hits a bead (stop-knot, whatever), you then get a continued Semi-Fixed set-up with the Lead offering resistance. If you have your indicator dropped straight down, and the slack line you stil get the indication. Seriously I use the Running Lead set-up on a large water and small waters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cocobeware Posted March 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2008 Think i may be down to my alarms coz i just dont get any indication on the buzzer untill the line is tight and moving over the roller I have the puckman pro logic ones... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salokcinnodrog Posted March 18, 2008 Report Share Posted March 18, 2008 Think i may be down to my alarms coz i just dont get any indication on the buzzer untill the line is tight and moving over the roller I have the puckman pro logic ones... Not being funny, but alarms that rely on a magnetic roller wheel are seriously less sensitive than the Sundridge/Dellareed Optonics that had a light breaking vane, and that includes Dave's Giant/RT alarms. The magnet wheels provide drag (more weight to move, increased torque, extra friction to overcome) as the line is taken, more than the water surface tension that gives tension to the line on a take, (I THINK), so the line may not actually be turning the wheel. A heavier/thicker line may make a difference(?) I went from Optonics that I had fitted with 12vane roller wheels to Delkims, and the difference with the Vibration was markedly improved. The only thing I had to worry about was working out how to cut down wind bleeps that I had not been used to! As good as cheap alarms are in terms of cost, they could well be cutting down your Running Lead effectiveness, but will be good with Semi-Fixed/Bolt rigs where the Carp ARE Running. A vibration alarm could well be the way forward, even without the Running Leads as eventually if you read the thread Stoogi and I picked out, Carp may start to get wary of Bolt Rigs. At this point you may definitely need to get onto Running Leads on your water anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coops_northants Posted March 19, 2008 Report Share Posted March 19, 2008 Just out of interest are you still using a hanger/indicator withthe slack line??? reason i ask is if you have a slack line the indicator gives enough resistance to the alarm to spin the wheel. If you have no hanger on then the line is sitting above the wheel and it will not spin as easily. With a slack line you register the bite earlier, reason is the line pulls tight and moves easier, a tight line needs the stretch of the line first before it takes line from the reel and so make the alarm beep. One thing, if you set your rods up on the bank correctly for running rigs you will get better indication and also be able to use lighter leads. The tighter your line the heavier the lead needed because underpressure the lead is a pivot point, slack it is not. The best way is tyo create as few angles in the line from reel to lead. meaning point the rod at the lead, and also angle the tip of the rod and butt of the rod so that the line comes direct from the line roller on the bail arm to the lead. All you then want to do is strip a couple yards of line off the spool, wait for it to settle and rest the hanger on the ground. Once picked up the hanger creates the pressure and the alarm beeps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
levigsp Posted March 19, 2008 Report Share Posted March 19, 2008 Just out of interest are you still using a hanger/indicator withthe slack line??? reason i ask is if you have a slack line the indicator gives enough resistance to the alarm to spin the wheel. If you have no hanger on then the line is sitting above the wheel and it will not spin as easily. With a slack line you register the bite earlier, reason is the line pulls tight and moves easier, a tight line needs the stretch of the line first before it takes line from the reel and so make the alarm beep. One thing, if you set your rods up on the bank correctly for running rigs you will get better indication and also be able to use lighter leads. The tighter your line the heavier the lead needed because underpressure the lead is a pivot point, slack it is not. The best way is tyo create as few angles in the line from reel to lead. meaning point the rod at the lead, and also angle the tip of the rod and butt of the rod so that the line comes direct from the line roller on the bail arm to the lead. All you then want to do is strip a couple yards of line off the spool, wait for it to settle and rest the hanger on the ground. Once picked up the hanger creates the pressure and the alarm beeps. I couldn't agree more,slack lines move the wheel on alarms easyer that tight lines. When im fishing slack lines I have my sensetivety turned right up other wise I would go mad with the constant bleeps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyc34 Posted March 19, 2008 Report Share Posted March 19, 2008 While using running rigs does leadcore create more resistance than lighter anti tangle tubing? Could leadcore possibly arouse a carp suspitions? Andy .C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salokcinnodrog Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 While using running rigs does leadcore create more resistance than lighter anti tangle tubing? Could leadcore possibly arouse a carp suspitions? Andy .C It definitely does not make for a 100% Safe way of Fishing a Running Lead. I really experimented with Leadcore on a water over Christmas/New Year time, getting into the water to check its safety aspect with regards as to its twist and trapping Run Rings, beads etc on it. It does not take much for leadcore to become dangerous (Leaders Thread and another in Advanced Carp Fishing, sorry can't remember which one). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyc34 Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 While using running rigs does leadcore create more resistance than lighter anti tangle tubing? Could leadcore possibly arouse a carp suspitions? Andy .C It definitely does not make for a 100% Safe way of Fishing a Running Lead. I really experimented with Leadcore on a water over Christmas/New Year time, getting into the water to check its safety aspect with regards as to its twist and trapping Run Rings, beads etc on it. It does not take much for leadcore to become dangerous (Leaders Thread and another in Advanced Carp Fishing, sorry can't remember which one). Tubing it is then. I haven't used running rigs before, I usually use Korda Inlines/Leadclips with tubing. Didn't know leadcore was prone to twisting. Valuable lesson learnt, hopefully others will read this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salokcinnodrog Posted March 20, 2008 Report Share Posted March 20, 2008 While using running rigs does leadcore create more resistance than lighter anti tangle tubing? Could leadcore possibly arouse a carp suspitions? Andy .C It definitely does not make for a 100% Safe way of Fishing a Running Lead. I really experimented with Leadcore on a water over Christmas/New Year time, getting into the water to check its safety aspect with regards as to its twist and trapping Run Rings, beads etc on it. It does not take much for leadcore to become dangerous (Leaders Thread and another in Advanced Carp Fishing, sorry can't remember which one). Tubing it is then. I haven't used running rigs before, I usually use Korda Inlines/Leadclips with tubing. Didn't know leadcore was prone to twisting. Valuable lesson learnt, hopefully others will read this. I'm lazy myself, and tend to buy the Solar Running Rig Kits. With the Beads provided you can make a safe Running Lead set-up and also a shocker set-up. I did have a look in Lathams Fishing Tackle, (Potter Heigham, or inside QD in Ipswich) and picked up some Zebco Run Rig Rubber and Rings. These are a nifty little set of Run Rings that go over the Swivel Buffer/protector that can also be converted to use as a Semi-Fixed set-up just by pulling the Run ring down to the base of the Buffer. I've also found that these Buffers take most sizes of Tubing. A tip for you if you want to pin your tubing down, and that is to put putty at the top of the Tubing, or on the Mainline, it sinks the top of the putty, and hopefully hides the rig tubing slightly. Some of the better putties can stick to the top of the tubing and not come off, so please check that it will pull off if you get a snap off. If you use enough so that the Run Ring can't pull off over it then you may be making a rig that is not safe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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