tomst Posted September 6, 2013 Report Share Posted September 6, 2013 Hi Guys, I've started fishing a new spot under a tree. I have an area of chod under the tree of around 4ft then weed on the bottom. I have been chucking out chilli hemp and crushed boilies, then fishing a short hinged chod rig with a popup. I had a fish today but the hook was in the top of its mouth and right on the edge which makes me think it might be foul hooked. I did have another aborted take an hour after. Should I go over to a bolt rig with long hook length and a balanced bottom bait? I want to keep feeding the hemp and crushed boillies as I am confident they get the fish in. Cheers Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hnv Posted September 7, 2013 Report Share Posted September 7, 2013 I take it this tree is on the near margin? I would bin the chod rigs and just gently lower in a braided rig with a bottom bait - if you are feeding chops then half a boilie makes an excellent hookbait. Fish with the rod tip low to the water with the line not too tight and you should get some action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomst Posted September 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2013 Yep, it's a short underarm flick out - about 2 rod lengths. Why would you ditch the chod rig? Because it's fished on a popup? The other thing to bare in mind is that crays can be a nuisance. Maybe a balanced fake chop on a semi fixed rig? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beanz Posted September 7, 2013 Report Share Posted September 7, 2013 any pop up rig fished over a tight baited spot runs the risk of foul hooking. when feeding on hemp the carp dont have to move far to keep feeding and they can keep their head down, where a spread of boilies over a large area gets them moving and also dropping the head down for each individual bait. in your situation,where i could see the bottom i would use a bottom bait with a small mesh/bag just to protect the hook. once the fish have cleared the weed id be happy to just flick out the hook bare.or if i didnt want any free offerings id balance the bait to slowly fall and settle on the weed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomst Posted September 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2013 Hi beanz, I can't see the bottom unfortunately as it's 6ft deep but i know that it's choddy where I have my bait not on actual weed. So I'm thinking a semi fixed rig with a 1oz weight, braided hook length then maybe tied KD style with a fake chop (one of the ones from Enterprise). That should stop crays pinching the bait. If I balance that so it sinks really slowly and cast it out with a small bag then I should be good? How would the fish feed if I am fishing chops and hemp? I am scattering the chops over a larger area to get them moving around, hopefully blending two styles of feed will mix it up a bit and get them off guard? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beanz Posted September 7, 2013 Report Share Posted September 7, 2013 a bag will add weight , so your balanced rig wouldnt fall as you want,but will still have the effect of flying up more freely when taken. the fake bait should mean if the crays turn up your still angling, i say should cause you never know with hemp they can become preoccupied on it so like i said...if their mouth is down on the bottom you dont want your bait higher. and as for the KD ,, im not the guy to ask i believe the way its tied has nothing thing to do with it hooking potential and its the fact that the hair when blown pulls at the eye and not bend. a standard knotless knot with 3-4 turns is exactly the same in my mind Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomst Posted September 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2013 Would you fish running rig to get some hints of bites? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beanz Posted September 7, 2013 Report Share Posted September 7, 2013 i use running for nearly all my carping,with a slackish line, i havent had a twitchy take ever that i can recall,(from carp..plenty of bream)all my takes are screamers. weed i like inline as it more stream lined and collect less. for extra distance i will use heli set ups( but it rare )or if needing a leader. and i dont use bolt set ups..just a personal thing, as iv never felt i needed to use the lead to hook'em. i dont think the lead set up plays a big part unlike location and bait for most situations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hnv Posted September 7, 2013 Report Share Posted September 7, 2013 Yep, it's a short underarm flick out - about 2 rod lengths. Why would you ditch the chod rig? Because it's fished on a popup? The other thing to bare in mind is that crays can be a nuisance. Maybe a balanced fake chop on a semi fixed rig? Some good advice there from Beanz... To answer your question: I am not a fan of the chod rig at the best of times due to the tendency for the mainline / leader to be lifted up off the bottom. This effect could be magnified fishing so close in on a slackish line. The fact that the bait is popped up is also perhaps something I would avoid when fishing over particles or chops. Just because it is choddy under the tree does not mean that you have to use a chod rig. Personally I would just swing out a little bag with a bottom bait (balanced if you like). If you are worried about the chod either drag a lead through it (you can get little "rake" leads with prongs on for this) a couple of times or give it a gentle rake - just not when you're fishing or the fish are there! The last time I fished under a margin tree, I just pulled a lead across the spot once to check for big snags and lowered a little mesh bag under it. It was away in an hour... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomst Posted September 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2013 Yep, it's a short underarm flick out - about 2 rod lengths. Why would you ditch the chod rig? Because it's fished on a popup? The other thing to bare in mind is that crays can be a nuisance. Maybe a balanced fake chop on a semi fixed rig? Some good advice there from Beanz... To answer your question: I am not a fan of the chod rig at the best of times due to the tendency for the mainline / leader to be lifted up off the bottom. This effect could be magnified fishing so close in on a slackish line. The fact that the bait is popped up is also perhaps something I would avoid when fishing over particles or chops. Just because it is choddy under the tree does not mean that you have to use a chod rig. Personally I would just swing out a little bag with a bottom bait (balanced if you like). If you are worried about the chod either drag a lead through it (you can get little "rake" leads with prongs on for this) a couple of times or give it a gentle rake - just not when you're fishing or the fish are there! The last time I fished under a margin tree, I just pulled a lead across the spot once to check for big snags and lowered a little mesh bag under it. It was away in an hour... Would you go running lead? And would that be inline or on a clip or not really fussed? Do you mean a small bag just for hook or a pva bag with lead and hook in? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hnv Posted September 9, 2013 Report Share Posted September 9, 2013 Not really fussed about the lead. I would use a lead clip rig with a little mesh bag on the hook. If you are worried about it being very choddy, then a little solid bag with a small inline inside it can give the confidence that your presentaton is good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomst Posted September 9, 2013 Author Report Share Posted September 9, 2013 thanks mate. Im going to head out in the rain this afternoon to test things out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salokcinnodrog Posted September 10, 2013 Report Share Posted September 10, 2013 Yep, it's a short underarm flick out - about 2 rod lengths. Why would you ditch the chod rig? Because it's fished on a popup? The other thing to bare in mind is that crays can be a nuisance. Maybe a balanced fake chop on a semi fixed rig? Some good advice there from Beanz... To answer your question: I am not a fan of the chod rig at the best of times due to the tendency for the mainline / leader to be lifted up off the bottom. This effect could be magnified fishing so close in on a slackish line. The fact that the bait is popped up is also perhaps something I would avoid when fishing over particles or chops. Just because it is choddy under the tree does not mean that you have to use a chod rig. Personally I would just swing out a little bag with a bottom bait (balanced if you like). If you are worried about the chod either drag a lead through it (you can get little "rake" leads with prongs on for this) a couple of times or give it a gentle rake - just not when you're fishing or the fish are there! The last time I fished under a margin tree, I just pulled a lead across the spot once to check for big snags and lowered a little mesh bag under it. It was away in an hour... Would you go running lead? And would that be inline or on a clip or not really fussed? Do you mean a small bag just for hook or a pva bag with lead and hook in? I'm the same as HNV in that I won't use a chod or silt set-up when fishing over particles close in. In fact my preferred method, especially when fishing one rod, is with lift float tactics if possible. If that is not practical then as long a hooklink as I can get away with and a bottom bait. I feel that pop-ups are a risk for foul hooking and fishing a bait above where the fish are feeding. That is not to say a pop-up won't work, as sometimes it could be the first bait taken, but that if the fish are feeding comfortably on the bottom, then that is where I want my bait. I tend to stick to my favoured running lead set-up with a coated and stripped back near the hook or plain braid so that the hooklink doesn't sit up from the bottom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomst Posted September 10, 2013 Author Report Share Posted September 10, 2013 Thanks for the advice Nick. I went out yesterday and didn't have anything off the area, however, literally right under my rod tip I noticed some reeds twitching so managed to sneak my bait in there and had one, only 12lb but something! I thought I would test out the KD rig on an uncoated braid with a balanced artificial chop. Turns out it hooked the fish in the top of the mouth so I'm going to try just a normal hair rig today, ditch the fancy stuff! I'm hoping this area will produce something bigger. One thing I notice is the crays get on the bait near enough as soon as I put the rig in. Do you think they would show themselves if the carp were in the swim? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrdevon Posted September 10, 2013 Report Share Posted September 10, 2013 The fact it's choddy as you say kind of becomes irrelevant when you're able to lower your bait in as you have the control and ability to nicely nestle the bait where you want it within reason without too much fear of it getting buried like you would if casting any distance Stick with your basic running rigs with bottom baits and fingers crossed the big 'un will be along soon If crays are a huge problem see about leaving a crayfish pot/net and removing as many as you can providing you're allowed plus they make great eating Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomst Posted September 10, 2013 Author Report Share Posted September 10, 2013 Cheers buddy. I think there's weird rules with crays isn't there? Something like you're not allowed to remove them but not allowed to put them back..? Maybe an old can of dog meat in the margins might help... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hnv Posted September 10, 2013 Report Share Posted September 10, 2013 Red Signal crays... Don't you just love 'em?? The few times that I have encountered them I introduce them to the sole of my boot... CRUNCH! My bother cooks and eats them, says that they are lovely. I just like to stomp 'em... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
salokcinnodrog Posted September 11, 2013 Report Share Posted September 11, 2013 Thanks for the advice Nick. I went out yesterday and didn't have anything off the area, however, literally right under my rod tip I noticed some reeds twitching so managed to sneak my bait in there and had one, only 12lb but something! I thought I would test out the KD rig on an uncoated braid with a balanced artificial chop. Turns out it hooked the fish in the top of the mouth so I'm going to try just a normal hair rig today, ditch the fancy stuff! I'm hoping this area will produce something bigger. One thing I notice is the crays get on the bait near enough as soon as I put the rig in. Do you think they would show themselves if the carp were in the swim? The fact that you can lower the bait in really helps. Crays can be a right pain in the bottom, although I'm certain that carp will eat small ones, even if they do leave the monsters. I've had baits that I'm positive have been crayed in the lagoons, a series of bleeps and later that night had a carp on the bait. When I retrieved the hook from the fishes lip I could see the meshed bait had been attacked, but the carp were still happy to take it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomst Posted September 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted September 11, 2013 Well I've been hammered by them today. Managed to pinch one cell popup but was constant plucking away on the line. Had to move in the end! One started to crawl out towards the waters edge so I tried to jab it with the landing net pole.. they're quick though! (Sorry, edited to remove censored NG) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muftyboy Posted September 12, 2013 Report Share Posted September 12, 2013 have you thought of trying crayfish tails as bait, you can buy em in morrisons i think or catch a cray and use a nice fresh one. mufty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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