adamkitson

Cheers! Gone for the 60" brolly. Will keep my fox royale 1 man with over wrap for the proper cold trips, and use the brolly the rest of the time. Gone for the new camo colour. Not really a fan of camo, but this is a bit different, I like it. Can't wait for it to arrive now. Gonna look great behind my new delks. Ah well, can't take it with ya!

Cheers Hutch. It looks a good bit of kit. Think I'll go for it.

Anyone got one of these? I'm looking for a new shelter, I literally never use the front to my bivvy. It lives it's life with the front rolled up, so I'm considering a quality brolly with just that bit more room than the average brolly, this seems to fit the bill. I also. Love the idea of mesh panels at the back for the warm days, and the new camo one looks great! I have a very slight concern. Every now and then when it starts chucking it down I'll drop down one side of the bivvy front to stop water running acros the groundsheet and into my stuff. Does anyone know how this particular brolly does in the rain? I'm has multiple front pegging points, so it can be dropped down lower. Does this do a good enough job of keeping the water out? I would be hanging on to my bivvy and over wrap for the freezing months, but for a 3 season shelter this would be it. I have a daiwa mission brolly, but the sides aren't really big enough and it's a bit small under it. Any opinions useful!

Dunno mate. I don't think I'd risk it. All I know is that if you believe a certain bespectacled gent currently prominent in the karp tackle world, stiff coated and stiff mono materials will take a crimp with no loss of strength, but soft materials won't. Reason for my post is I'd really like a soft material for the boom section of a rig I'm working on, but the rig would lend itself well to a crimp. Wondered if anyone knew of any softer materials that you can crimp. Not a worry though. I think I've worked a way around it now.

No wouldn't have thought so. I think with the softer coated braids the inner braid can pull out of the crimp leaving the outer coating behind.

Doesn't look stripped from the pic. Yeah I know the stiff materials will take a crimp. I'm looking for something a bit more supple though. Fig 8 loops and shrink tube it will probably have to be.

Anyone know of any coated rig braid that will take a crimp? Looking at a fairly supple braid, like n-trap soft, but I know it's no good for crimping. Cheers.

I have yet to come across a lake with crays. Long may that continue! This is great! In most walks of life nowadays there are more and more things/people that make me feel old. Good to pop along here where it seems to work the other way!

Ah, yeah it's firesure now. Softer silicone insulation and a single conductor rather than multicore 4mm. Probably would work better. (On the other hand, probably will just stick with tungsten tubing.)

Yeah. I bet this whole "mainstream" carp fishing movement drives you nuts if you've been in the game for many years. I've fished since I was 7, on and off, which is still "only" 25 years, and I've fished pretty much every fresh water method/species and a few salt water too. I joined my first carp syndicate when I was 17, and have been pretty much just carp, with a bit of barbel and fly thrown in) since then, and I find it hard enough to swallow the preachy nature of some modern day ticket anglers who, as they speak, you can picture the episode of thinking tackle that it came from. No personal experience or trial and error at all, just parroting someone else's incites. Must drive you nuts if you've been in the game for 20/30/40 years! That's why I like my little secluded Shropshire syndi, with nothing much over 30, and a challenge just to get a run. But most of the time I've got it to myself, or other like minded anglers. Drives me mad sometimes, but I've done the day ticket thing sporadically, and always come back to the peace and quiet of harder lakes with smaller fish and less of them. Next time I've stripped off a length of cable I may even be tempted to give is a go! And with the eu harmonised colours there's brown to use now too!

Unless tubing is in the rules! I must say Nick, one thing I haven't given due time to is a running rig. Can't say as I've used that since feeder fishing a quiver tip for roach and bream. Although come to think of it I've done a handful of barbel trips on the Severn in the last few years, and I wouldn't think of using anything other than a running lead. Another interesting thought in terms of safety, swam the lead and rig locations and you've got a heli rig. They still part ways just as easily. Wow I've never heard of stripping electrical cable for rig tubing. I'm an electrician so I'm stripping cable every day. Never though of substituting my supple tungsten tubing for a length of brown insulation! Wouldn't fancy trying to get a meter in one go either, although I bet it goes on the line easier!

Really only this year got into using tubing almost exclusively instead of leaders, and thinking about it even more with an upcoming social on Holme Fen where 1m of tubing is a requirement and no leaders of any kind are used. Have to say, the more I think about it, the more I believe it is the safest most versitile setup you can have. With the change of a single knot and accessory you can switch between lead clip, drop off inline, running, and rotary/heli with absolutely no safety compromise. In face, in most cases much safer! Actually think I may be done with leaders all together. I've only used them for heli setups in recent years, but now a solution to that has become obvious I don't even need them then! Anyone else fish like this? People who don't, with the exception of shock leaders, what is the benefit as you see it of a leader over tubing?

Only had a couple of full on screamers on helis. Normally it's a bobbin bouncing around without taking line off the clutch or straight to the top and staying there. From my experience and in my opinion: Tight lines take the sensitivity right out of it. Tried this on dry land and in water, any stretch in the line gives the fish that much extra room to move before any indication. Also means the bobbin has to be right at the top. As I said, the majority of bites I get don't take line off the clutch. Back leads are a requirement. Without and the line must either be tight, see above, or slack enough to curve onto the lake bed which reduces sensitivity as well and allows the lead to move without indication. With enough line out under this kind of slack there comes a point where the weight of line alone is enough for the lead to move without the bobbin moving. I use fox captives. Once attached and suspended I slacken off from the clutch until the lead just sits on the bed, then attach a light bobbin and slacken from the clutch to sit the bobbin 6 inches dropped or so. This creates a delicate tension between the light bobbin, the back lead, and the lead. No slack, but no stretch. The indication does not rely on the main lead moving, it relies on the lead and back lead staying in place and the mainline being pulled left or right, at any angle. With the tension right between the leads and a light bobbin it is impossible to move the mainline more than a few inches, before the lead even moves at all, before the bobbin is bouncing. The distance from lead to top bead is important. The longer the chuck the higher the bead needs to be. At 100 yards I'm putting it at the top of a 1m leader. Never less than 1ft from the lead. PVA foam on the hook every chuck forces the rig up to the bead as the lead hits the water. Might be a few inches back by the time it hits the deck but fairly well up there. There is movement here for the fish to run straight towards or away, but upward movement of the mainline has the same effect on the bobbin, and if the hook catches at all it'll be hard to get rid of as the back lead keeps the line straight and on the deck, pulls the hook down by the weight of the line but no lead to flick around and movement of the rig on the mainline. Very hard to shake. Drop backs are fine too, although not common as on the take the fish almost always rises off the bed when the hook hits which registers. It's not without its faults though. Works best at 30-80 yards. Much closer and there's not really the line length for it to be balanced and solid, much further and you need a fairly light line and a very high top bead. Sometimes need to over cast on tight spots. Flourocarbon, forget it past 60 yards. Too heavy. Not an issue for me as its a rare occasion I'm casting past 70 yards. If there's an undertow it's not ideal. The delicate tension is what makes it work. If the line bows out it becomes too tight. Captive back leads are a bit of faff, although they do mean the system works just as well in weed, as long as there's a few feet of margin to get the back lead down clean. Deeper the better, ideally at full depth but no more than a couple of rod lengths out. Needs a fairly heavy lead. Key to the indication is the lead staying fixed, so the movement created by the take has to go somewhere, ie the bobbin. The force required to move the weight of line from rig to bobbin has to be less than the force required to move the lead. 2.5oz up to 50 yards, 3 or even more past 50. if it's weedy and the line is pulled into weed then the heavier the better. Again just my thoughts and experiences on it. I don't know if I'm missing pickups. Certainly don't get any "funny" bleeps, unless the roach are at the pop up. Line on the deck so no line bites, and I've been out in a boat over far margins and couldn't move the bait more than a few inches by pulling on the pop up without indication. It's all about what we're confident in at the end of the day, and set up like this I'm 100% confident that it's working for me. Of course if I'm proved wrong I will change!

I currently have subline on my reels. It's ok. I loved it at first but a few trips in and it's already not feeling as good. I don't use it all the time as I often use flourocarbon on my other spools. If I'd done a whole season on the subline I'm sure I'd have changed it already. It's ok. I won't take it off for the sake of it, but I wont be re-spooling with it when this lot is finished. If I were you I'd go with one of the other recommendations.

No need to be sorry Nick, I'm not the one struggling with helis after 20 years of trying. Just from that post there are several things I'd want to be doing/not doing for it to work as I use it. Is it at all possible that even though you yourself have not got satisfactory results from using heli setups that it is still possible for someone to do so? Or is the implication that I'm basically lying about how sensitive it is when I'm using it? Apologies for my curt response. I mean no offence. There just seems to be a run of responses that are along the lines of "well it doesn't work for me therefore it doesn't work at all." Pretty much always not the case.

I am a massive advocate of a rotary/helicopter rig. I fish them in many situations. For one reason because you can be almost assured of good presentation, and secondly because when set up correctly, having no knot attaching the rig to the mainline/ leader etc is about as safe as it gets. I will say agin, when set up correctly. I've spent a lot of time playing around with this set up. People who are getting bad indication, it is because of how you are setting it up, normally line tension, bobbin set up, incorrect use of back leads etc. I was fishing this last week and was getting annoyed by single bleeps from roach knocking the hook bait around. Trust me, when set up right if it were moved 20 yards it would be a one toner! Back to the op, it's perfect for silt! +1 on the use of string/floss for "plumbing" silt depth. Works a charm!

Exactly beanz. The hook bait is what it is if it's on the hook or not. Pop up is a pop up. Add a weight to it so it sinks, still a pop up. Wafter sinks slowly, hook or not.

That is exactly how I would see it.

Don't know what to tell ya. Got "wafter" written on the tub. For me, a balanced bait is a bait that floats, but the buoyancy and hence how it acts is affected by weight you add to it, hence, balanced. A wafter, by definition, wafts as it slowly sinks. The bait sits on the bottom like any other bottom bait, but the buoyancy in the bait negates the weight of the hook attached meaning it acts as a normal freebie would when eaten. We're probably just arguing semantics here though. I just see a huge difference between a balanced bait and a wafter. For me they have totally different functions.

Nope. Depends on the buoyancy of your wafter. Some that I have sink if you drop them in the margin with no hook, but very very slowly. I wouldn't want a wafter that sat off the bottom. For me it's just a bottom bait that lifts easier when sucked up by a fish.

Was chatting with someone about dogs the other day. Correct word for a female dog?? Forget it! Perhaps the Internet bots don't get context, although they're getting it pretty well right in this thread!

Good topic though! I love me a heli setup, and I've never had issues with it as I know others have. Interesting to hear others opinions/experiences. Personally I think it's the back lead and the delicate line tension combined with a bit of distance from the lead and slide in the rig that does it. Literally 4-5 inches of line difference between how I fish them and fully slack, but enough tension to hold a light bobbin up.

Don't know. I don't. Bottom bead right on the lead, top bead a foot or two up. I like a bit of distance from the lead, and for me it helps with indication.

Hmm, yeah a chod is undoubtably a rotary/helicopter setup. Not really something I've fished a great deal. I don't think I'd fish a chod on a leader. I don't see the advantage over a helicopter with a stiff hinged rig with a soft boom section or a multi or something. I do have the stuff for a naked chod setup with lead drop system, but I've only used it once and still used a back lead. Didn't catch though so I doubt it was still sitting up on the weed as it should. That's a good point actually NM. Chods, either on the line or on a leader are widely used and account for a fair number of fish. So how do they differ in bite indication terms from any other rotary setups?

Yeah well I don't doubt the experiences of others, and I fully agree that a heli on a slack line would be daft. In fact a running lead is about the only setup that I think could be effectively fished on a slack line as the fixed lead gives a point for the line to run through which is the only way a drop back would be registered on a slack line. This is pretty much why I abandoned slack lines in favour of back leads and light bobbins. Best of both worlds for me. Line is still tight enough to register a drop back if the lead is picked up, but no straight lines through the water to spook fish. In low weed in fact, once the line is in the weed between the leads I think you'd have a job to find it even knowing it was there. Bare in mind also the lake bed I'm specifically talking about is a smooth uniform depth from a rod out. I think the key to heli sensitivity is this back lead creating a second pivot point with a small amount of tension between the two. Increase the tension, bobbin up, slacken the tension, bobbin down. It's a delicate setup and from my experience it certainly works. Yes, with a tight line and a heavy bobbin, a semi slack or slack line from the tip to the lead I can see how the fish could move, lead, rig and all before registering, but i just don't see it affecting my setup in this way. Certainly if it is possible it's nothing I've ever experienced. Even if a fish moved sideways to the line very slowly it would add tension to the line and lift the bobbin. I've always felt that if the rig were fixed closer to the lead it wouldn't work as well. I like the rig right by the lead on the cast as the anti tangle sleeve is over the lead swivel which eliminated tangles, but the top bead a foot, even two up so it sits away from the lead on landing. Actually the further from the lead the better the indication as more of the pressure is put on the rod side of the line. Of course if the fish swam head down straight to the lead it would get that distance before indication, but then it would hit the lead and take off. Probably how the coule of one toners I've had have happened. I dunno. I don't like to be blinkered by one approach or you stop seeing the advantages of various setups and only compare what could cause them not to work, not why they may be better. For example, I've fished a lot of silty venues which has caused me not to spend a lot of time looking at running leads. Just by pulling the lead out when retrieving I can tell it's well into the silt. For me personally anything other than a rotary setup of some kind could affect presentation. I get what you mean about swivel damage fishing inlines over gravel. I must say, if I get on a lake with decent gravel areas I'll have to look at setups for that situation. My first thought there would maybe be a lead clip. I've not used one for ages, apart from a bit of lowering it in margin stalking. I wanted the bolt response then as a hooked fish charging out of a feeding spot didn't put off the other fish. They were well clear before I got to the rod. Worked well. Horses for courses I think. And having confidence in a variety of methods and an awareness of how to use each one effectively can only help when dealing with different situations. I feel I've cracked it with heli's now, but they are showing shortcomings in my current fishing situations, so I'm trying something else which I'll refine until I get that right. If things change again, so will I. I'm not going to be stuck to one thing as nothing is optimal everywhere, including running rigs.