Getting done…..

[peg101]

I just came back from a long session where i am i`m sure i was getting `done` by some carp who seemed to be able to throw the hook before bolting (giving a few more bleeps than you would normally get from a liner). I eventually caught one and dropped one by shortening the hooklink down to about 4 inches, adding some silicon tube so that the hair came off the bottom of the bend of the LS hook and upping the lead size to 5oz. At the time i choose this over moving to a running rig as i thought the lead wasn`t doing it`s job but i`m now thinking that the much bigger lead could have actually helped the second carp throw the hook. I didn`t get a bite on the rods i changed to coated braid with just a tiny amount stripped back at the hook to create movement.

 

I still need to try a running rig but after a bit of reading on the net i`m interested in trying an anti-ejection `stiff rig` which is basically a stiff nylon/fluro-carbon direct the hook. There seems to be 3 options for the hair; either use the hooklink material knotless-knot style, whip some braid into the hook knot or make a D and use a ring/floss.

 

I`ve some questions which i`d appreciate some feedback on;

 

1) Why is this rig difficult to eject?

2) How stiff is too stiff? Would a chod filament be too stiff?

3) Which is the best option for the hair for a 16 or 20mm bottom bait

 

Thanks,

 

Peg 101

[marty_h]

I would never run anymore then a 2.5 oz myself. The rig ive been using a lot recently is the combi rig you know it always has good presentation and it does not give the fish much room to do you as the main part of the rig is stiff link. Its basically similar to the rig you mentioned

 

I was on a water recently and the fish where only giving a few bleeps and the bobbin hardly moved and looking at the rod tip it was bouncing ever so slightly so every bite like that i pulled into and the fish was on. They did not run but simply sat there trying to shake the hook out the older fish are clued up.

 

 

Here is the rig i use i have since took the braid down to around 1" at end and has produced more. I also now either put some putty or a Korda sinka over the knot

 

 

[Phil]

What bottom were you fishing over peg101?

 

Also, how were your indicators set up?

[marty_h]

What bottom were you fishing over peg101?

 

Also, how were your indicators set up?

 

 

I was fishing over gravel about 5ft from opposite bank.

 

I used both the stow bobbins I have and even tried putting the solar ones I have on. I also turned the sensitivity up on the Delkim TXi's out of the 6 fish I had only 2 ran the other 4 gave 3 or 4 bleeps and bobbin hardly moved but rod tip was twitching. I dont run slack lines and bobbins where set high. Ive seen that happen quite a few times on there its as though they just sat there trying to shake the hook

[mrdevon]

Sounds like bream to me, I get that all the time on the river

 

What bait and size were you using?

[Phil]

I would be tempted to fish a running lead with shortish hooklink. Then fish my line semi slack with backleads to help pin it down a tad, trying to cut out potential liners.

[salokcinnodrog]

If everyone fishes with rigs of 15cm long, or everyone fishes a chod rig with a bright pop-up then the better the fish learn to deal with it and catches go down.

 

By changing from the norm, creating different circumstances, then the fish can't cope with them and (your) catches go up.

 

 

Years ago I fished a water where everyone fished with rigs between 20 and 30cms on semi-fixed lead set-ups. As a result the carp would back-off slowly with the hook in their mouth the length of the rig, and were quite able to eject the hook. By changing to a longer or shorter rig the fish were hooked as they weren't expecting it. Switching from semi-fixed leads to running rigs also increased catches, although I didn't tell everyone that I had switched. You were confusing the fish from usual circumstances.

 

While I have used a stiff rig with a knotless knot made from Amnesia, I feel that to some extent the hair needs to be supple (this is after a couple of hookpulls on the stiff hair), and allow some bait movement, which the stiff hair prevents.

 

My answer to this was to switch to a D-rig, knotless knot the hook, but putting a ring on and then the tag end back into the eye and lighter tagging the end to prevent it pulling back out.

The hair I would then make from either dental floss or light mono of around 4lb.

 

In fact for a period of time it was my standard set-up with a snowman bait as it worked so well. It does work with bottom baits if the water is clear and mostly weed free.

 

I did another version with a supple hair, which was a bit more fiddly to tie though, with a braided material (whipping thread, floss) or fine mono, and attached the hair to the eye by knot and whipped it down the back of the hook. The hook knot I then covered with a small piece of shrink tube to protect the knot and hold the whipping and hair in place.

 

Both versions work.

[hnv]

Great post Nick...

[peg101]

What bottom were you fishing over peg101?

 

Also, how were your indicators set up?

 

I was fishing over firm silt. The bottom was really clean.

 

I was fishing in open water about 65m using a micro bug bobbin that was just 'cocked'. I had added a flying back lead and an actual back lead when I changed the set up.

[peg101]

Sounds like bream to me, I get that all the time on the river

 

What bait and size were you using?

 

Fortunately there are no bream in this county (Japan). Unfortunately the nusiance fish equivilance (Hera buna) is worse as they just sit there tethered and don't swim off!

 

I was using single B5s in 16mm or 20mm that had been glugged.

[peg101]

I've had a play around with some different materials and have made a few different rigs to try. The Gardner Trip Wire that I got free with a mag subscription is slightly stiffer than some Korda IQ2 that I bought. I've tied a variety of rigs and the stiff hairs look least appealing. I'll get some photos up and give them a go next weekend.

[peg101]